A prime Vasyl Lomachenko lost fair and square to Orlando Salido who already had 12 losses @ the time

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by WARDisTBE, Jun 15, 2017.


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  1. yesihavearm2

    yesihavearm2 ESB Chinchecker Full Member

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    My money is on this being an MVC alt
     
    yesihavearm2, Jun 16, 2017
    yesihavearm2, Jun 16, 2017
    #16
    greenhornet and lewis gassed like this.
  2. Jeremy Kyle

    Jeremy Kyle Well-Known Member Full Member

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    2nd pro fight isn't prime, Loma's skills are legit as ****, but its still too early to claim p4p status. You only become p4p by fighting the best and beating the best, It doesn't matter how good you look fighting lesser opponents, You have to earn your spot fighting the best,Every fighter needs that career defining fight. Mikey Garcia is loma's current ticket but the fight doesn't look likely, which is a dam shame.

    I am a loma fan and a ward fan so put that in your pipe and smoke it. No discrimination here just honest opinion, I call a spade a spade.
     
    Jeremy Kyle, Jun 16, 2017
    Jeremy Kyle, Jun 16, 2017
    #17
  3. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    Do you really feel a fighter with only 2 pro fights was prime? I dont think many fighters with only 2 pro fights would do well against a world champ, even if they have 12 losses. Some of those losses were before some would have called Salido prime and Salido has some decent wins and taken the 0 of some other world rated fighters.

    I see your name, so will ask, do you feel Ward was prime in fight 6 when he looked fortunate to some against Boone, or when he was hurt by Kost?

    I can understand why Lomachenko is in the P4P as he has won a world title in his 3rd fight against a decent undefeated opponent (Russell 24-0), has beaten a decent fighter in Walters (26-0-1), world champ Martinez, and Tatakhun 52-1. His loss to Salido was close and all of that is in under 10 fights

    Cant see why you dispute Lomachenko as a top 10 P4P. He is #6 with the Ring that many use as their benchmark for ratings. Probably because it calls itself the bible of boxing???
     
    bailey, Jun 16, 2017
    bailey, Jun 16, 2017
    #18
    RacingBeat likes this.
  4. WARDisTBE

    WARDisTBE Son Of God Full Member

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    Those numbers are irrelevant. The only thing that matters is winning. Ward keeps fighting the best and keeps beating them all.
     
    WARDisTBE, Jun 16, 2017
    WARDisTBE, Jun 16, 2017
    #19
  5. yesihavearm2

    yesihavearm2 ESB Chinchecker Full Member

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    You completely missed his point.

    Ward wasn't prime after his 2nd pro fight, and neither was Loma.
     
    yesihavearm2, Jun 16, 2017
    yesihavearm2, Jun 16, 2017
    #20
    Serge likes this.
  6. Ant Sutton

    Ant Sutton I love boxing Full Member

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    Yep...Salido won with a big ***

    This content is protected
     
    Ant Sutton, Jun 16, 2017
    Ant Sutton, Jun 16, 2017
    #21
  7. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    lol Thanks
     
    Serge, Jun 16, 2017
    Serge, Jun 16, 2017
    #22
  8. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    I didn't even get into the size of Loma's plums compared to the ones not swinging between the deck stacking, loaded dice rolling Oakland CoWard's chicken thighs. Loma was doing things and taking risks in his 2nd and 3rd fights CoWard still hasn't done to this day and won't ever do.
     
    Serge, Jun 16, 2017
    Serge, Jun 16, 2017
    #23
    greenhornet likes this.
  9. bcr

    bcr Well-Known Member Full Member

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    -Name one fighter, just one, in boxing history, that can beat a profesional world champion in his second pro bout, because you seem to be missing the fact that Salido was the reigning champion back then.
    -Also, Salido's record doesn't defines his quality, that's how records usually look when you turn pro at 16 in mexico, with the difference that most of them wouldn't manage to ever win a world title.
    -2 good wins?, He beat prospect of the year and current world champion Gary Russell Jr., undefeated world champion Nicholas Walters, world champion Jason Sosa who was in the momentum of his biggest win against Javier Fortuna, world champion Rocky Martinez (who dropped Mickey Garcia, considered by many the toughest test for Lomachenko) and the fact that he beat all of them in under 10 fights, schooling all of them, stopping three of them, making two of them quit on the stool, beating the prospect of the year and former olympian by domination and scoring a knockout of the year candidate against the other one.
    Just saying.
     
    bcr, Jun 16, 2017
    bcr, Jun 16, 2017
    #24
    kriszhao, BoxingABC1, RacingBeat and 2 others like this.
  10. Cafe

    Cafe Sitzpinkler Full Member

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    Walters was considered elite and Loma schooled him to a No Mas. That's a nice boost.
     
    Cafe, Jun 16, 2017
    Cafe, Jun 16, 2017
    #25
  11. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    Salido had lost 12 fights when Loma fought him. However, like a lot of Mexican fighters he turned pro at a very young age (he was 15 when he made his pro debut) and he either had a very limited amateur career or he didn't have one at all. So he was obviously doing his apprenticeship and learning his trade back then, which is why he went 8-6-1 in his first four years as a pro and was stopped in 5 of those 6 loses - 2 by KO and 3 by TKO. He obviously improved a ridiculous amount after that atrocious start. He was fighting grown men back then and he had terrible management too.

    Salido had only lost to 4 opponents in 12 years when Loma fought him. Four loses in 12 years all bar 1 on points (a TD loss) as opposed to 6 loses in 4 years, 5 by stoppage, when he turned pro.

    Let's take a look at who those fighters were who inflicted those defeats on him during that 12 year period and moreover what their records were when he fought them

    Juan Manuel Marquez 42-2-1 - Marquez had just drawn with a prime Pacquiao in his previous fight.

    Mikey Garcia 30-0-0

    Yuriorkis Gamboa 18-0-0

    And a SD to Cristobal Cruz 36-11-1 (don't be fooled by the record Cruz was a good fighter) which Salido avenged 3 fights later by wide scores.

    Salido was down against the excellent Garcia 4 times but he was actually coming back into it a bit and causing Garcia some problems before the head clash/butt busted Garcia's hooter. IIRC he won the 6th round.

    Salido floored Gamboa.

    And the Salido that Loma fought weighed 128ΒΌ on the scales, 3lbs more than Loma and he had a 11lb weight advantage on the night, whereas the Salido that Marquez, Gamboa, and Garcia fought had to drain himself down to 126 and they were all roughly the same weight as him.

    Gamboa 140 - Salido 140

    Salido 147 - Lomachenko 136

    Marquez was coming in close to 140 whilst campaigning at FW, probably round about 138 give or take a pound.

    And Mikey Garcia who was a huge FW and even a huge SFW (he was walking around at 154 when campaigning at the later) was coming in at 140 when he was campaigning at FW too.

    Loma was 1-0 when he fought Salido and he had never been past 5 rounds before

    And he fought Salido in Texas which is tantamount to a home fight for a Mexican, especially one who's facing an opponent from somewhere as far afield as Ukraine.

    Marquez had been past 8 rounds something like 19 or 20 times when he fought Salido.

    Cruz had been past 8 something like 28 times when he fought Salido.

    Gamboa had fought past 8 rounds 4 times when he fought Salido.

    And Garcia had been past 8 rounds 6 times.
     
    Serge, Jun 16, 2017
    Serge, Jun 16, 2017
    #26
    kriszhao and Gannicus like this.
  12. Jackomano

    Jackomano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    This. Loma's an excellent fighter, but it's too soon for him to considered pound for pound. He beat Walters, who is a good win, but he was coming off a year layoff and Sosa, who was also a good win. However, neither Sosa or Walters presented any stylistic challenge or threat to Loma.

    I think Loma should try unifying his division rather than rematching Salido, since I think Loma would lose again.
     
    Jackomano, Jun 16, 2017
    Jackomano, Jun 16, 2017
    #27
    WARDisTBE likes this.
  13. yeyo monster

    yeyo monster Boxing Addict Full Member

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    White boy alert
     
    yeyo monster, Jun 16, 2017
    yeyo monster, Jun 16, 2017
    #28
  14. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    You best be alert when you're around me ******
     
    Serge, Jun 16, 2017
    Serge, Jun 16, 2017
    #29
  15. yeyo monster

    yeyo monster Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Wanna u gonna do flower boy? You are gonna hit me with one of your ggg posters full of cum? Go eat your corn flakes fruit cake!
     
    yeyo monster, Jun 16, 2017
    yeyo monster, Jun 16, 2017
    #30
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