A theory about Ali-Frazier 3

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by bloomstomb, Apr 18, 2009.


  1. bloomstomb

    bloomstomb Guest

    I have watched this fight a bunch of times and something about round 14 realy keeps nagging at the back of my head.

    Ali wanted his gloves cut at the end of that roud, a round in which he completely oblitirated frazier. I get the feeling that he wanted to quit because he did not want to hurt(kill) Joe.

    I would not put it past Ali to do something this crazy (and compassionate).
     
  2. djm

    djm Boxing Addict Full Member

    3,208
    2
    Dec 17, 2006
    Not sure where you are going with this... you think he was going to give up the HW title after 14 brutal rounds out of compassion? The compassionate man that tortured Terrell and Patterson and villified Frazier in the press?

    You're gonna have to back that up with more than "I wouldn't put it past him".
     
  3. MexicanJew

    MexicanJew Jajajajajaja Full Member

    7,315
    3
    May 19, 2008
    Ali has said he wanted his gloves cut off because he honestly felt like he was on the verge of dying.
     
  4. bloomstomb

    bloomstomb Guest

    Well, he was asking his corner to cut the gloves. Many people heard this happen.

    And what I mean by not putting something past Ali is I just FEEL that behind that fassade, he was a compassionate man, even for his oponents (most of them anyway).

    I think the bad blood between joe and ali only ran one way. Ali was just doing his crazy promotional stunts.
     
  5. bloomstomb

    bloomstomb Guest


    I know what he said m8, but come on. After the 14th round, with 1 round to go and probably not even 1 round with the shape frazier was in, do you honestly think, do ANYOF YOU HONESTLY THINK that Ali would quit because of exhaustion?

    Do any of you think ali is a quitter? I know you dont. and to me it just doesnt add up.

    Ali didnt quit when there was no hope and put himself in a position where he could have been killed, but he never quit (ali frazier 1).

    But after 14 rounds, where he absolutely mauled frazier in the 14th, suddenly he is on the verge of dying from heat exhaustion?

    And what of the reaction when he found out joes corner stopped the fight? Was that the reaction of a exhausted man on the verge of death, where he jumped out of his seat, alert, surprised and relieved?


    Let me put it to you guys this way. I think Ali would try and get out of a fight before he killed someone than he would to save his own life.

    He is not a quitter.
     
  6. djm

    djm Boxing Addict Full Member

    3,208
    2
    Dec 17, 2006
    As far as "theories" go, this one seems pretty air tight.
     
  7. bloomstomb

    bloomstomb Guest

    I bring you my first witness as a testament to Ali's courage and compassion.

    George Foreman.

    Please watch 6:25 to 7:00 of this interview.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JWgD_eXiDU&feature=related


    And again :50 to 1:20 of this part of the same interview.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdpeGhI4mAM&feature=related



    The facts are this.

    Ali asked for his gloves to be cut at the end of round 14 after one of the most brutal beatings you will ever see in boxing... And it was Ali who was giving it the beating.

    Ali was also willing to give foreman a rematch had foreman rehired dick saddler in his corner (whom foreman blamed for the loss and I assume Ali felt partialy responsible for) . Doing something good for no other reason than the goodness of it. And when foreman refused, Ali worked with the man.


    My argument is simply this.

    I do not believe Ali would quit because he felt exhausted. He would simply pass out from exhaustion before quiting. He also did not look exhausted while he was devestating frazier during round 14.

    I believe Ali would never have quit that fight or any fight because of exhaustion, pain, lack of will ,threat of death or any other reason.

    I believe Ali's compassion possibly drove him to wanting to quit that match when it was all but over with him winning.
     
  8. Cachibatches

    Cachibatches Boxing Junkie banned

    10,261
    12
    Nov 12, 2006
    The Ali that called Floyd Patterson a White mans N---

    The Ali that tortured Ernest Terrell: "What's my name?"

    The Ali that referred to Joe Frazier as a "Gorilla"?

    Ali was a great fighter, but is a pretty terrible human bing. Sorry, but its the truth.
     
  9. crippet

    crippet Well-Known Member Full Member

    2,377
    20
    Dec 1, 2007
    Ali asked to quit against Liston when he had a substance in his eye
    Ali did quit against Holmes
     
  10. itrymariti

    itrymariti CaƱas! Full Member

    13,728
    46
    Sep 6, 2008
    Ali didn't feel compassion. If anything, he'd have wanted Joe dead after calling him a n*gger, an uncle tom, a gorilla, a two-time slave etc.
     
  11. bloomstomb

    bloomstomb Guest

    Do you buy into every promotional gimick? Or his strategy to get into other boxers heads BEFORE the fight to give himself and advantage ?

    Or his tactic to get into their heads DURING the fight?

    Come m8, think it through.
     
  12. bloomstomb

    bloomstomb Guest


    Goddamn theres a big difference between calling a man names , no matter how deragotary, and killing him.
     
  13. pare

    pare Active Member Full Member

    626
    2
    Oct 20, 2008
    if he was truly compassionate, he would've seen the hurt he was doing to frazier, and the others, but especially frazier. no bud, he was a pretty self-absorbed guy.

    and as for the "it was only one more round" comment, i'm sure you and most on this forum have pushed their body to the limit and know how easy and tempting it is to quit. e.g. if you do any heavy weight training, then you know that sometimes you feel like you just CANNOT do one more rep and STOP, even though you've done that tons of times before.

    just as frazier himself only put a meek struggle against futch, it's totally possible (and probable in this case) that ali couldn't take it anymore.
     
  14. MagnaNasakki

    MagnaNasakki Boxing Junkie Full Member

    7,658
    78
    Jan 21, 2006
    I think the fight was decided in Ali's mind. He was tired, he wanted to go home. He had thoroughly beaten Frazier, in much the same way Frazier beat him in the 1st fight: Wore him down(In Thrilla's case, busted him up) and then kicked his ass.

    Rounds 13 and 14 are far to overlooked by Frazier apologists. Ali was HAMMERING the man. Round 14 was as bad a beating as Frazier put Ali through in round 11 of there first fight. The man was done, and getting knocked pillar to post. Ali had beaten the man. Frazier will never admit it, but sadly for him, at the end of the final fight of the greatest ever trilogy, the lesser human being proved the superior fighter, and was handing him his ass.

    After all the terrible bull**** Ali put Joe through, damn, that had to suck. I dont believe Ali wanted to quit out of compassion, or weakness: The man was just done. He had been through an exceptionally grueling experience, and he had just finished demonstrating that Frazier was no longer in the fight. He would have answered round 15, and fought it for 3 minutes; He just didn't want to.
     
  15. Cachibatches

    Cachibatches Boxing Junkie banned

    10,261
    12
    Nov 12, 2006
    This is ridiculous. Calling someone the N word or purposely prolonging a fight to torure a man is are not promotional gimmicks.

    Face it- you just have a bad theory here. Ali was a great fighter, and a very bad man.