About what time did Tyson drop off from being an "elite" HW?

I agree. By elite I read great, easily the best, HoFer, atg candidate etc and I maintain that level of Tyson went before the Douglas fight. With the clarification that its means one of the best around well that was clearly later. By the time he decided to eat Holy rather than try and beat him his days a world champ were clearly over.

 

Not true. When he was released from prison. The public forgot all about the Douglas fight. Another thing people tend to forget is after the Douglas bout, how Razor Ruddock gave him pure hell in both of their fights.

 

I think Tyson was an "elite" fighter for just about all of his career. His last four fights are hard to tell though...

Against Lewis: Tyson looked awful...BUT he was fighting Lennox freakin' Lewis. Lewis was still a great fighter at that point. Tyson may not have been prime, or even great, but I think he was still a good fighter. If he was fighting an average top ten contender that night, he could have won, he could have lost.

Against Ettiene: Tyson ripped through him with ease. (with a broken back! ha ha!) Hard to tell how good he was.

Against Williams: I think Tyson looked okay here. His hands were quite quick, his loss seems to be due to an unfortunate injury.

Against McBride: Again, Tyson looked like a decent fighter, not anywhere near his best, but still decent...he just gave up. I don't know why, maybe he was tired.. I don't know. He just did not want to fight.




I think it was all mental with Tyson. Even the faded version had more hand speed than just about any other heavy at the time. He still had that power. He just did not have any hunger to be great anymore. I don't know when he lost it.

 

Seriously, i think Mike knows when he felt his decline...that was when he started making outrageous antics like excessive intimidation and fouls( eq..elbows, twisting arms) in and outside the ring. and that was evident in the 1st Bruno fight... In his prime, he was able to crush and break down opponents opponents by skills, punching power, speed, and patience in the ring and by being smart enough not to get hit.

 

My opinion is..... really after he fought Ruddock twice.. those fights contributed to him losing his desire and hunger.. Prison took his natural spirit away and from Mcneeley on he was half a step behind what he was prior to all of that...........

examine it further... Botha was doing a great job outboxing Mike...
Orlin was awkward and Mikes wreckless streak brought him a No Contest..
Golota... Mike was just a plodding head hunter with no jab and no head movement..
Holy 1 and 2 were the end of his mythical aura...
Neilsen was a harder than expected test..
Lewis was a sad bout......
Williams and Mcbride were the mere bones of a great ex champ.........

 

I would have to agree with BigCat. Mike was basically around to collect a paycheck after prison.

 

when Jim Jacobs died

 

Holyfield fight. Everyone thought he would walk over Evander in one or two rounds. Then he was destroyed and outmuscled by a small heavyweight. Evander sort of outmuscled him and outfought him. The Mike of 1987 would have beaten Evander in 1996 though. I think. Mike had a small window of greatness from 1986-1989.

 

When he started getting real famous, and got married.

 

I strongly disagree, Tyson may not have been the most focused fighter but when he fought he did fight hard, during the Nielson Fight is was clear that he was shot, against Botha and Golota he was faded But he looked like a guy that could be great with the right training routine,vbut the guy that fought neilson was a mere shell of what Tyson was in his day.

 

Jennifer, Tyson did not look good at all in the McBride fight, he didn't even look decent. He looked more like Fred Sanford. It is one of the worst things I have ever seen.

Also, the Tyson you saw in that McBride fight, wasn't far off from the Tyson you saw in the Lewis fight. Lewis fans don't like to hear that, but if we really look at Tyson, it is the harsh truth.

Poor Tyson was just fighting for money. Reminds me of those old actors that are still trying to make movies still, to pay the bills. Sad.

 

Mike had fallen off long before the buster fight. Changes in he's attitude and regime were apparent from he`s first fight with Bruno. Mike consistently didnt train and spent more time smoking drugs and fornicating. He lost he's desire to fight when DKP entered the scene and team Tyson eventually disbanded. The Buster loss was simply the culmination of all the events prior to this. Mike had no desire to train, he's personal life was a mess, he didnt like boxing anymore and mentally being such a weak and dependent individual was led down the garden path by a man who wanted only he's money. What we saw post prison was a man fighting on talent and fumes alone. Mike barely even trained for most of he's fights after that and said during jail that he hated boxing and wanted to retire. The money he owed because of DKP was the only reason why he's career ended up being so long.

 

A few months before the Buster Douglas fight, he was already starting to slow down with the money, parties, drugs, girls, complacency etc.

 

Anyone who loses to Kevin McBride is not a good fighter. Tyson was utterly shot by that point.