Aj what level is he actually at?

Tbf we can do that to anyones record. But the truth is all of them are dangerous opponents for a former cruiserweight. Even with audley...i know people criticise him and rightfully so but if audley connected on people he was still a dangerous opponent. The truth is tho as soon as haye threw he knocked him out. Knocked barrett and ruiz down about 4 times each. Not many done it to them throughout long careers. Had valuev doing the funny dance about the first clean punch he hit him with. Sparked chisora in 5. On top of that almost everyone at cruiserweight got dealt the same fate. That momeck was a quality fighter. Enzo was decent. Again its the manner in how he done it. The powers definetely there...even against the heavyweights. The 2 fights that went the distance he never really went for the ko. His hand speed still looks very good. He doesnt have that many miles on the clock. He has good ring iq.

No ones saying hayes got a great resume at heavyweight. Your right in saying ruiz was 38 at the time. Etc etc. But the truth remains nearly everyone hes went out to knock out...has went. Klitchko and valuev he couldnt get to...pretty much fought to a game plan against valuev due to his size. And klitchko pretty much outfoxed him using his size which hes pretty much the master at. I dont think he ll have the same problem with joshua tho. Joshua will exchange no problems. It wont be a battle of jabs for example for any length of time cause hayes straight right will win that war. Anyone that comes out to fight against haye...is on dangerous ground for me.

Haye will go down one of two routes. There actually wont be many punches thrown in the fight. It ll be like audley over again. He ll look to counter a mistake. Its allright saying joshua throws punches but a guy with proven power like haye can keep anyones punch output down.

Or he ll let joshua go on the offence then look for a counter.

If its the fight goes the first way haye will win it. If it goes the second it ll depend if joshua can outmuscle him with his energy and power or if haye can get something in. My moneys on haye getting something in. Joshua wont take much once he does get hit clean.

Heres exactly what haye will play on...joshuas big swings. There too slow. Hes got relatively fast hand speed but when he starts swinging hes wide open. You were right haye overreaches a lot...but he rarely gets caught because he knows when to throw that way. He misses but there threw when the opponent isnt expecting it. Hence the reason he gets away with it. Joshuas way more predictable. Any predictable fighter struggles against a good counter puncher. And haye is a good counter puncher. Valuev and klitchko just used there height/reach to negate him. As i said joshua doesnt use it so well.

 

Thing is, most of what you are saying about Haye can be said about AJ already.
It amounts to: He faced who was put in front of him ... and he mostly knocked them out in style.

Now, of course, with AJ we can't give him the benefit of being "a former cruiserweight". But the flipside to that is ... he's a big natural heavyweight ..... and that usually suggests there's more potential to be a destroyer in the division.

I do agree that Haye's resume, even at HW, is better at the moment. But not by that much, imo.
And if you look at the big picture, recent form, activity, age, career stage ... things look far better for AJ as 2016 turns to 2017.

The only way to favour Haye is if you believe in some distinct stylistic advantage or clear gulf in overall skill, which you (bbjc) do, so that's fair enough.
Personally I just don't see it.

 

Yet AJ has a limited shot selection and got rocked by a p*ss poor fighter in Whyte, yet you can't see how Haye isn't more skilled?

Shill.

 

Come on. I've given plenty of assessment of Haye's skills (and lack of), and you can either agree or disagree, go watch the fights, go watch the Barrett and Ruiz fights and you will note Haye's technical weaknesses if you watch with an open mind, and against p!ss poor fighters too ! .... and I don't dispute any of those criticims towards AJ. I fully agree with them. I think AJ is almost completely unproven. He's overrated as it stands, and his next fight will prove nothing.

No need for name-calling, but surely you're the shill.
Shilling for Haye, 110%, aren't you?

 

Only thing i ll add bud is the difference in the resumes is the guys josh has been battering martin breazeale whyte. Dont have a single name on their ledgers of any serious fighters. Wins or losses. Totally unproven. Not counting the guy martin won the title off who got injured early in the fight.

Whereas barrett, ruiz, harrison, valuev, chisora all had names on their resumes and were proven solid heavyweights. Not spectaculor but proven. They d all earned their stripes to an extent.

Your right barrett ruiz didnt exactly fight him at the peak of their careers...but they were not finished fighters either. It wasnt like the american boy that turned up to fight joshua think chisora beat him in his better days. Cant remember his name.

I think molina is actually a decent progression for joshua. Taking away the world title and the ppv aspect. He ll ask more questions than breazeale and martin asked him. Its a little more dangerous than people are willing to admit.

 

Dominic Breazeale was coming off a win over Amir Mansour, who was a nobody really, but as good as anyone Audley ever beat.
I mean, who has Audley got? A win over a late-sub Danny Williams? A win over Sprott? Two domestic-level guys who also beat him.

I guess, when it comes down to it, you could say Dominic Breazeale is not better than Arnold Gjerjaj or whatever his name is, and I really can't be bothered to argue fine points like that because I don't have much interest in defending AJ's sh!t resume.

Yes, AJ's resume is total sh!t and I really don't understand why we spend so much time talking about him. He's a joke but the whole division is too.
My views on David Haye are along the same lines.
I don't understand this high regard for David Haye, especially now in 2016, and I never will.

No wonder promoters make all these sh!t fights. It seems the fans these days are easily impressed by thin resumes, poor fights, and guys who don't fight at all.

 

Ruiz had already announced his retirement before the fight.

He was only given the fight so that Don King could get his contracted second pay day for gifting Haye Valuev's belt (who probably also never intended to fight against after the farce against Haye).

 

How did that work tsar. Was ruiz a king fighter at the time as well?

Ruiz always turned up about the same for his fights. He was long in the tooth against haye. As you said about ready for retirement. But it wasnt exactly like ruiz came into the fight as unrecognisable from his other fights. His weight etc were pretty decent for that fight.

 

Agreed with the **** fights. I must be one of the worst boxing fans ever tho mate. I somehow dont mind waiting on the big ones. Makes you anticipate them more....too much of a good thing and all that. Especially when you know they probably will happen.

Wierd one with the heavyweights atm with fury reliqueshing the belts. Looks like everyone at the same times went for the cop out fight this time round. But can see it kicking off the next round of negotiations. In the next year or two.

 

people forget that Bruno was 21-0 21KO when he first got put in with a live fighter

Being very wary not to get caught up in the hype train until he's been chinned by an elite level fighter.

Eddies following a tested formula with this guy.

 

Yeah, it's shocking that AJ can hold a "world title" and is looking forward to a second successful defence based on a 17-0 run against ordinary/weak opposition suitable for any prospect.

He might have been more tested by going for a Lonsdale belt outright, a Whyte rematch then Chisora or Haye.

 

Honestly, I wouldn't count on the fights happening.
It wouldn't surprise me at all if David Haye never fights again, and certainly wouldn't surprise me if he never fights a quality opponent. Not that he's a big loss to the sport, imo. I kind of consider him retired.
Wladimir might never fight again, he may well be too old, he might well lose if he ever comes back.
Tyson Fury, who knows?

AJ, Wilder and Parker (assuming he's the next WBO champ) could spend years not fighting each other.

 

Personally think theres too much money on the table for them not to happen. I really think the heavyweight division will open up with the klitchko,s losing their control on it. Took a blow with losing fury. Just wish their was no rematch clause with klitchko and he could have moved on after dethroning him.

But looking at the division its still pretty stacked. Ortiz signing with hearns gives him new oppertunities. Parkers getting better and better. Klitchko will be back so will haye imo. Wilders a good addition. If whyte takes out chisora he can be pushed back in the mix. Pulev and guys like that still around. Joshua looking good. Think of it back to after lewis retired...the klitchko,s basically killed it. As good as they were they took the entertainment out of the division with their style of fighting. They were basically too good for the rest for years. Looking at that division theres a lot of contenders looking around the same level. Plus the moneys there from hearns side at least. They can make astronomical money fighting joshua etc. Klitchko s no longer have their beat us and its an instant rematch power. Parker and ortiz surely up for names. Even wilder will want the big money etc

 

The Whyte rematch would have sold, and it is far more interesting than a Molina fight, even if AJ already has Whytes number.

I really don't rate Whyte that highly, and his so called KO power is vastly overrated, but people should go back and watch how little that punch that shook AJ travelled and look at the effect it had on him.

AJ looks sturdy enough going forwards and unloading, but absolutely clueless on the back foot, and when he steps up a level he will find that his offensive skills aren't enough to keep his opponent from backing him up. I also think he will be undone as soon as any decent puncher finds the target.

Wilder has a resume full of cans, but i'd pick him to stop AJ.

 

You can compare the Whyte fight to Jumbo Cummings and Bruno. That was a marker that his chin was not going to hold up when he stepped up to guys who weren't washed up or going to keel over. Hence Jim Smith and Witherspoon. Joshua will stop Molina but we're talking about a guy on the level of a Greg Page or David Bey in the 80s, not Witherspoon or Smith.