Ali 1967 vs Frazier 1967, who wins?

ali easily.......

 

In FOTC Ali's harder punches was down to style, that he sat on his punches more. At 215 lbs in FOTC he was just a couple of pounds heavier than in 1967 and his upper-body wasn't quite as ripped as it was pre-exile, so there's no reason to believe that any physical factors made him punch harder.

In Manilla, on the other hand, Ali had been lifting weights to build up his strength and came in at 226. This version of Ali hit harder than he did pre-exile, both because he sat down on his punchers and because he was bigger and stronger.

 

Ali has the legs to stay away, wins decision

 

Ali wins over Frazier by UD, by 10-5,11-4, or even 12-3 if the situatiion is right.

 

I don't think Joe would have been ready for Muhammad until after he got the championship distance in Bonavena II under his belt in December 1967. As for Ali, Chuvalo had given him that championship distance experience with a hard body puncher by the time 1967 rolled around.

 

Agreed,

Frazier, although a very solid contender by 1967, was still somewhat of a work in progress, while Ali was at the very peak of his game.. I think Muhammad takes a comfortable decision, and with any luck maybe a late stoppage.

 

Ali by decision or possible TKO .. Joe was way too green ... like Sanchez v.s. Azumah ...

 

How about 1967 Ali vs the Joe Frazier of March 8, 1971...the FOTC Smokin'Joe...

 

be a very close hard fight but i pick a top conditioned ali not to rest on any ropes and have enough to prevail. fotc ali started throwing big punches in the first and was tiring badly in the later rounds - 67 ali liked to move, find his range and weigh up his opponent first and not waste his punches - he fought a lot smarter and didn't get hit as much. frazier would always give ali his hardest fight IMO and that's against any ATG cuz of the relentless pace and stamina in the way that he fought.

 

I was going to mention that same Ring Magazine article but you beat me to it. I believe Yank Durham's feeling was that Frazier was at least a year away from a title challenge.

 

Joe wins

 

Ali relatively comfortably. It would look like the second fight but for 3 more rounds. I don't think it would've been an exciting fight had Frazier fought Ali pre exile.

 

There's no way that Joe would have been ready for Muhammad in 1967.

 

Ali's exile cost us a truer prime versus prime matchup circa 1969-early 1970, a bout I just can't see Joe winning.

It's been proposed on this forum that a busted leg Smoke sustained after Ellis I may actually have caused him to also be slightly past peak by the time of the FOTC, while it's always been presumed that Muhammad was still improving at barely two months past age 25 when Folley took place.

1967 Ali versus FOTC Frazier is intriguing, because Joe would have likely had the punch rate in his favor, and Muhammad didn't mind giving away body shots. The flip side is that Ali wouldn't have been against the ropes and in the corners, but continually on the move, and significantly faster and better than Smoke ever experienced him to be, according to the accounts of Patterson and Chuvalo. My guess is that a running Muhammad takes a close 15 round UD in a match which is hectic for him, and frustrating for Joe, who would be swatting a lot of air with his hooks upstairs, and not able to chase as fast as Ali could retreat. Muhammad got the championship distance with Terrell under his belt in 1967, and Ernie was competent over that limit in winning three straight over Machen, Chuvalo and Jones going into the unification with Ali. Granted, Muhammad did get in nearly 15 rounds of work when dispatching Bonavena, but try watching only the first 14 rounds of that one, after viewing the entirety of Ali-Terrell.