Ali Against Quarry and Bonavene?

You can certainly make that argument--as Ali was ultimately vindicated by the 1971 Supreme Court decision on his conscientious objector status. In fact, because of this legal decision an argument can be made that the record books should have been adjusted to show Ali as HW title holder from March 1967 to March 1971.

 

Ali retired before the Frazier vs Ellis fight putting end to his claim as the champion. He even wanted to hand over his Ring belt to the winner, but the comission didn't let him. He was a contender after he came back.

 

Yes they are lineal title fights.

 

Ali publicly abdicated his title before Frazier-Ellis so no Quarry and Bonavena arent titke defenses in any sense of the word.

 

Corbett abdicated his title to Maher. It didn't work.

 

But it did this time. Frazier became the undisputed champion, recognized by The Ring as well, and the vast majority of the public looked at Ali as a contender, like at Jim Jeffries stepping against Jack Johnson.

 

He never lost the title in the ring so people still viewed him as champion and how FOTC was to determine who was the “real champion”.

 

Very few people realistically considered Ali the champion. He hadnt fought in three years and had formally abdicated before his comeback. Yes, some people considered him "the peoples champ" but these were largely casuals and people who did so based on political motivations. The VAST majority of people DID NOT consider Ali the champion and when he returned to settle who really was the champion he lost.

 

Actually going by the WBA ALI -WON IT 4 TIMES , Liston, Terrell, Foreman and Spinks. Boxing Life had gone on after Ali relinquished his

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crown to Frazier-Ellis winner. So they were not Officially Title fights, Albeit they were both scheduled for 15 rounds.

Here's one for ya , the WBA did not consider Ali a top ten contender or ranked at all during the fight of the Century vs Frazier . (Ali was #1 contender for everyone else) Ali had to beat them in court 6/29/71 to get his ranking back. They Had undefeated Foreman as their No.1 contender at the time.

 

WBA HAD NO PROBLEM RANKING Dave Zyglewicz, Terry Daniels, Joe "King" Roman, and Alfredo Evangelista in their top ten's during their title tiffs!- And WBC was worse. The very start of a big A to Z Boxing titles, & Organizations!

 

Hi Guys.
Mmmm, all this talk from posters about Ali retiring @MaccaveliMacc and abdicating @RockyValdez leaves me very confused ( not for the first time I hear you say ) as I remember the situation, Ali was stripped of the title in or around 67 for refusing the draft, a decision by the way which was reserved by the supreme court in 71, also I don't recall Ali abdicating the title before the Frazier / Ellis fight in 70, mainly because he had no title to abdicate ? have I recalled correctly, or is it time to view nursing homes.
stay safe fellow posters, chat soon.

 

So, there are 2 things, alphabet belts and being recognized as the heavyweight champion by the public.

He was stripped by WBA in April 1967, by NYSAC in May 1967 and by WBC in March 1969. So until March 1969 he held at least one alphabet belt. But people didn't care abut the belts much at that time.

After being stripped by the WBC he was still recognized as the world champion by the public and The Ring Magazine, which was the outlet that truly definied who the king is back then.

In January 1970, in the eye of the Frazier vs Ellit fight, he decided to retire and abdicate, to make room for the winner to be recognized as his successor. He even wanted to hand the winner his Ring magazine belt, but he wasn't allowed to. The Ring respected his decision and stopped recognizing him as the champion.

Since he retired, Joe Frazier ultimately gained the universal recognition as the world heavyweight champion after beating Ellis. Ali was therefore coming back as a contender.

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Thanks Buddy.
Nurse, nurse......