Ali & Floyd: Arrogant and Funny vs Arrogant and Abrasive

Seriously?

I'm racist because I mildly insulted the great Muhammad Ali?

**** you, cuchulain. You're either a grade-A ****, or pretending to be one. Either way, we're done here. :hi:

 

You're getting a little touchy, for someone whose not afraid to dish it out.

(**** you , Cassius etc.)


If you go back and check, I said :

Some of your true colours might be starting to show.


And nowhwere did I say you were racist.

I pointed out that certain things signify or symbolize a particular attitude.

Not ALWAYS does the Confederate flag indicate racism.

But it usually goes with a 'good ole boy' mindset.

And not always does calling The Greatest 'Cassius Clay' indicate loathing and hatred. (Ther'e also some who are just plain ignorant, in the literal sense of the word).


So if the shoe fits...



I didn't feel you would be particularly offended to be branded as an almost pathological hater of Ali. You have made little effort to conceal your disdain.

And a couple of posts ago, I was tempted to suggest we move on, as this wasn't going anywhere in the way of a 'frank and useful exchange of ideas' as the politicians sometimes say.

If you re -examine the dialogue in the light of a new day perhaps, you will see that I did not toss any epithets, like '****' or '*****' or '**** you' around.

I merely drew your attention to my viewpoint and pointed out a stereotype (perhaps applicable, perhaps not) of folks who refused to refer to Ali by his legally, universally recognized name.



Till later.:hi:

 

:huh

Strange thread, on many counts.

Interesting though.

 

As do most

 

Cant do anything about hero worship my man.

Remember what Joe Frazier said when asked what he thought of Ali lighting the Olympic torch? "I'd have liked to have pushed him in" :rofl


Put it this way, Ali is living on some farm in Michigan. Frazier is living in the middle of the ghetto in Philadelphia. Who's more pro black?

 

Hardly Joe's classiest comment. It just illustrates the bitterness the poor guy carries around.

Your logic is impeccable.

Joe has (sadly) fallen on hard times and sleeps in his gym.

And Ali has managed to keep some of the money he earned. And from this you can deduce that Joe is ''...more pro black?"

You're a veritable ****in' genius !






(BTW, I notice you had no response for post # 97)

 

Great post. I don't want to disrespect the man, what he did was in the past, it's history, but calling a spade a spade, Ali was no angel.


Ali's poetry was funny, he was more articulate and had a talent for speaking, but that doesn't make him a better person than Floyd. All the **** he said about Fraizer, speaking at a clan rally and all his other comments were ****ed up, plain and simple. I'm too young to really know what America was like in those days but if there was more racism, surely Ali's comments were even more ****ed up because of that.


I like Mayweather's style although it can be boring at times, but his personality I'm not a fan of. Maybe he's really a good guy and just playing the villain role, I don't know. He's no angel either but he hasn't gone as far as Ali did, we do know that much,


Just because Ali was more articulate and funnier doesn't make him any less abrasive. I think Ricardo Mayorga is a great trash talker, very funny but he's still a *****. Some people seem to have a problem with Mayweather's commnts but no problem with Ali's because Ali wrote good poems and was funnier. So as long as you're funny you can say what you want? Hell no, now that's some ****ed up ****.

Up to a point I have no problem with that view but if you cross the line, it doesn't matter how funny you are, it aint right. I'm not trying to judge the man but pointing out the double standards.

 

I have no response because you've yet to say anything intelligent or factual. A white european commenting on American racial issues. Hmm methinks you are a little out of your element,


Sorry, Ali said some ****ed up ****, was a womanizer, and could be as crude as anyone. For instance calling the Beatles a bunch of ***gots.


Oh and if someone called me a gorilla and comparing me to an animal on national television while also calling me an uncle tom, I'd hold a grudge aswell.

 

It really does come down to icon worship, I think you've hit the nail on the head.

It's like trying to explain to people that Kurt Cobain wasn't a talented musician ("Oh but look how influential he was, and how many times over Nevermind went platinum!") or that Marilyn Monroe wasn't an ATG actress, model or singer, and hundreds of thousands of more attractive women have been born and died since her.

That said, I'll defend Cassius Clay (through age 22) and Muhammad Ali (pre and post exile) the BOXER against anyone who tries to tell me that the BOXER is overrated or in any way undeserving of the universal praise rightly enjoyed by him. Among prizefighters he is justly an icon (even if in my more obstinate moods I try to find ways to squeeze Louis and Holmes up on the top pedestal with him). The only ones who overrate him as a boxer are those who try to pass him off as the all-time #1 P4P (Sugar Ray who??), which usually betrays such people as being as close to true boxing fandom as 'martial arts enthusiasts' who claim a prime Bruce Lee is historically invincible in head-to-head terms are to knowing a damn thing about any actual combat disciplines.

As a MAN, he is certainly lionized and excused to a ridiculous extent. This thread is all the testimony to that one would ever need.

Just pollutes people's minds to the point that there's no point even conversing with them.

Sorry I pointed out that certain things signify or symbolize a particular attitude that might indicate you were acting like a ****, cuchulain. It was just the idolatry talking, that's clear now. I forgive you.

 

I'm still offended by Rolling Stone picking Kurt Cobain as the 12th greatest guitarist ever, and not having Slash in the top 100.

 

Been travelin' IB, so I haven't been on here for a couple of days.

And this is largely a dead issue at this point.

But could you point out with specificity anything I posted that appeared as though I was acting like a ****.

In fact, given that I respect your posts as a rule, I was quite surprised by the vitriol in your posts.

Nowhere can I recall saying anything remotely offensive to you, despite your vehemence.

If you'll have a look, you will see which of us was tossing the insults and which one remained reasonably detached, or at least avoided tossing insults.

You failed to adress any of the points I made to you regarding Ali's vindication by the US Supreme court and zeroed in on my annoyance at your unwillingness to call him by his name.

In short, having read literally thousands of your posts, I found your attitude here totally out of character.

I actually wondered if someone else was using your account !

Clearly, I will never change your outlook on the man.

I can only go back to my first point in this matter,one that got Mr. Rand' knickers in such a knot re idolizing etc:

The opinon you expressed is not very widely shared.

 

You have no response because, unlike IB, you're not that bright.

There was nothing in post #97 that was not FACTUAL.

Do you have any idea what a complete ****ing idiot that kind of statement makes you look ?

Europeans can't have opinions on World issues ?



If I was as much of an idiot as you I might ask:

Why the **** is a kid who wasn't even born at the time, yakking on about American racial issues in the sixties?

You weren't there, and like many others, haven't a clue as to the context of the remarks and what brought them about.

 

Ali is the greatest sportsman ofall time. Floyd is an exceptional boxer but not in ali's class. Why should ali have went 2 nam,he stood up for what he believed in "man i aint got no problem with them vietcong". RESPECT. Went 2 the jungle and produced the best master class ever shown in a boxing ring against the most feared puncher in boxing history and said after the fight for everybody 2 bow, LEGEND AND THERE WILL NEVER BE ANOTHER SPORTSMAN COME CLOSE TO HIS GREATNESS.

 

They are both assholes, but at least Ali fought the best out there.