ali from zaire vs dempsey of toledo

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Yes, and my point is that his tactic of holding on worked perfectly well.

Then why was this lightheavyweight never knocked down or even stunned when initiating all those clinches (and there were many!) ?

Because Willard was a hyped up, 37 year old, inactive, farm boy with very little boxing skill or instinct. When he got tagged, he just stood there and let Dempsey tee off on him. Ali ranks at the absolute highest level of surviving these kind of situations.

This analogy is not valid, and do you know why?

Ali proved several times to be capable of beating fighters (much) greater than Leon Spinks and as great as Larry Holmes. Dempsey never proved he could convincingly beat Tunney, Sharkey or opponents of that level without controversy.

Firpo was a horrible boxer whose only reason to be top ranked is because Kearns saw an easy opponent and because the HW division was dreadful at that moment, with half of the contenders drawn from lower weight divisions.

Yep, and Ali beat Patterson easily, twice. Plenty of trouble? You mean winning 3 rounds before being stopped in the 7th round?
As for Chuvalo, he is not at all like Dempsey, and still lost the vast majority of the rounds.

It's certainly not going to be easy and anything can happen in heavyweight boxing, but i'd be pretty confident in betting on Ali.

 

GEEZUS!!! Granted, Dempsey was soft and somewhat *****-whipped in 1926 for Tunney up in Pittsburgh, Pa...... Rumor also says Dempsey had a stomach virus going into his title loss fight with Tunney....... Alright... Dempsey dropped a decision to Tunney over 10 rds........ No biggie.......

Come 1927, Dempsey had plenty of time to train and prepare.... He roared from behind to KO Sharkey with a left-hook to the chops..... Next up was his famous rematch with Gene Tunney in Chicago...... Again, Dempsey lost......... You know, Jack Dempsey was only between 31 and 32 yrs of age when he fought Tunney in '26 / 1927........ Tunney was just two yrs younger than Dempsey.......

Age was NOT a factor in Dempsey's losses to Tunney..... Not at all............ Inactivity and dickin' around Hollywood during 1924 and 1925 is what hurt Dempsey...... In truth, Dempsey lost his eye of the tiger in 1923 at age 28.........

MR.BILL

 

You need to ask the question, who would do better against Ali, Joe Frazier or Jack Dempsey? Frazier is bigger and stronger by around 20lbs, more relentless and able to walk Ali down due to his strength. Ali may well manhandle the 185lb Dempsey as he didnt have Fraziers strength to keep Ali backed up and whats more showed against Tunney he would have massive problems with a style like Ali's.

ALi UD or late stoppage

 

Ali lost to Joe Frazier who weighed 205 lbs. When Frazier put on 10 lbs, Ali managed to beat him. Dempsey is much faster than Frazier.

 

Frazier was 209 when Ali beat him the first time. In Manilla Frazier was 215, but then Ali himself was 225.

 

Ali puts on a clinic. I wouldn't be surprised if he won by stoppage, either.

 

Not a great fight to sit through.... Still, Ali was in total control and mainly doing what he wanted to do with Patterson..... Patterson was hopping around like a rabbit with his gloves up high trying to avoid punishment..... It only allowed him to survive a while longer....... Ali won........

MR.BILL:bbb:deal

 

Dempsey somtimes came in as high as 200 lbs during his prime and while Frazier might have some weight advantage I dont think the evidence suggests that he was ever a particularly strong heavyweight relative to others of similar weight.

I dont think that he was necisarily strongar than Dempsey and I am almost certain that he wasnt stronger than Marciano.

 

No way dempsey beats ali of zaire who had a clear size and strength advantage.

Dempsey's best chance would be landing a bomb on a green cassius clay who was hurt and dropped and seemed more vulnerable than Ali of the 70s who could take tremendous punishment. Even then I think his only chance is a lucky KO because he aint UDing Ali.

 

All Gibbions did in that fight with Dempsey was hold, and than Dempsey would thown a lot of inside shots, rabbit, and kideny punchings to boot.

No way was he thowing 20 punchings a round in the later rounds of that fight, he had a pretty high out put in that fight in the clichs.

Dempsey beat Gibbions pretty easy imo. I RELLY had a hard time giving a round to Gibbions in that fight.