Ali vs Marciano: 1950's style

Yeah but Marciano didn't have the speed of foot like Frazier that would trouble Ali. Frazier wouldn't let him breath which forced Ali into fighting off the ropes, as relentless as Marciano was he didn't have the speed IMO to get to Ali like Frazier did.

 

Frazier himself stated his feet were slow but in terms of hand speed "watch out"! It's another myth Rocky was slow. Was he Ali in terms of speed no but who is? Again if Frazier gave Ali hell in three bout so would Marciano. He had two fisted punching power unlike Joe who only carried effectiveness in his hook. His low crouch would make him a tough target for any tall boxer. No chance prime Ali gets stopped. Only chance Rocky gets stopped is on cuts. Great fight and its pick em.

 

it's a simple choice. either take notice of Marciano's so called " expert " fans, or believe the mans own observations regarding Ali's hand speed. The guy was capable of moving into range, landing 5 or 6 shots and be gone out of range again before his opponent could even think about reacting, never mind landing a counter punch. People talk about Louis, Dempsey, and Tyson's hand speed, yet they are as nothing compared to 60's Ali.

 

Fraziers feet were like lightening compared to Marciano's and so were his punches. It was mostly those fast lunging left hooks that were catching Ali by surprise and most of the time he pulled away just in time before they could do their full damage. IMO Ali wins comfortably on points.

 

You overestimate Frazier and underestimate Marciano.

Mid ring Ali can dance at range but he won't be there all the time as he would be driven into the corners by Rocky and there is where he does damage.

Marcianos low crouch and underestimated defense will make Ali miss many of his punches. Walcott and Moore felt they could hit Rocky as will.... Never happened. Fighting low and small and doing it well as Marciano did is a very effective way to handle a taller boxing opponent. The taller fighter has to reach down to hit and then is in range for counters. tough fight as Ali himself said so. Non prime Ali loses to Rocky I am sure on points. Both in prime it's pick em but I would say Ali has the edge since he could box and move for 15 rounds. In a 16 foot ring however there is not much room to move so again it's pick em.

 

I'm all for believing the principals.
Marciano said in no uncertain terms that he could have beaten Ali in their primes.
Ali said he didn't know. It could have gone either way.

 

Marciano was slow. Almost every contemporary observer mentioned that he was slow, including Goldman.

Worse than his slow delivery was his really bad balance. He was off balance so often a taller, faster, more mobile foe would have a field day on those openings.

 

For a slow fighter he kept up well with Wacott, Moore and Charles. All speedsters. You never get the feeling in any of these bouts that Rocky is being outsped.

 

Ali has to fight 3 minutes of every round against Marciano...something he rarely did. No waving to the crowd...no shuffle...none of that works against Marciano.
The Rock was mentally tough as well...he's on Ali all night long. Along with his two fisted power...his stamina...his chin and his high work rate...he'd be hell for Ali in the 1950's or the 1960's. A left jab isn't going to keep a guy like Marciano at bay for 15 rounds. My all time favorite dream fight.

 

Mine too.
Marciano-Liston is another dream fight.

 

Yes, these guys were all at their peaks.

I stated that Marciano would be a dream for a faster, much longer and taller opponent. None of those guys was especially fast by the time Marciano met them, especially long in reach, or especially tall. The tools that Ali would have to work with are poison to a Marciano. Throw in the fact that Ali had an ATG chin and I am not seeing a lot of hope for the Liliputian Son of Abruzzo.

 

I think McVey was being sarcastic here Janitor. I could be wrong.

 

Nobody beats Ali at his best but if you wanted to try and make it happen put him in a really tiny ring with Rocky Marciano. It would be his worst nightmare.

 

Frazier had better hand and foot speed than Marciano. Marciano
had two fisted power to even things up. Louis had no difficulty jabbing Marciano and he was well past his best.Ali would slice and dice Rocky.

 

Longer reach does not mean you land jabs. Fighting well in a crouch can negate completely an opponents height and reach. Ali as he did in every bout with Frazier would miss a huge percentage of his punches. I rate Ali no 1 and the rock well below this level. However great crouching punchers would do at least well against Ali. No cakewalk. This would include Frazier. Dempsey and Marciano. Of the three Frazier is at the bottom and he gave Ali hell in three bouts.