Amazed by Monzon

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Beau Geste, Dec 24, 2009.


  1. SLAKKA

    SLAKKA Boxing Addict Full Member

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    1. Carlos Monzon "el Macho" /
    Author: Cangoni, Pierre.
    Publication: Paris : M. Lafon, 1998
    Document: French : Book
    Libraries Worldwide: 3 New York Public Library
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    2. Monzón : secreto de sumario /
    Author: Staiolo, Marilé.
    Publication: Buenos Aires : J. Vergara Editor, 1991
    Document: Spanish : Book
    Libraries Worldwide: 3
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    3. Mi verdadera vida /
    Author: Monzón, Carlos, 1942-; Cherquis Bialo, Ernesto.
    Publication: Buenos Aires : Editorial Atlantida, 1976
     
  2. natonic

    natonic Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Agreed. I think highly of Valdez but Hagler had the abillity to keep the majority of this fight at range. He had a superior jab and lateral movement (I don't think that can be questioned). Valdez would need to stop Hagler to beat him. That's unthinkable IMO.
     
  3. KTFO

    KTFO Guest


    :patsch
     
  4. GPater11093

    GPater11093 Barry Full Member

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    Locche was a hell of a colourful character and really was the darling of Argentina. The crowds there really was behing him chanting 'Nico, Nico' in Luna Park.

    Thanks might have a look around for them
     
  5. Beau Geste

    Beau Geste Active Member Full Member

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    Thanks! Unfortunately I can't read in any of those languages. I will have to wait for an English version!
     
  6. Beau Geste

    Beau Geste Active Member Full Member

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    Sweet Pea, I am not underrating Hagler. I think he was a great fighter. Just not as great as he is given credit for being.
    I do believe Valdez could have beaten him. Valdez is underrated by many on this board, including you. If not for Monzon, Valdez would have dominated the middles in the 70s.

    I agree, Hagler was very skilled; however, his mental fortitude was not one of his strengths. In fact, it was his achilles heel. The first Antuofermo fight would not have been close, if it was not for Hagler's mental lapse. He dogged it in the late rounds. Ditto with Duran. And Leonard was able to psyche him out. If Monzon had been around in his prime in the 1980s, Hagler would have been number 2, much like Valdez in the 70s. However, with no Monzon, he was able to look great against a weaker field than was around in the 70s.

    And remember, Valdez was able to beat a prime Vinnie Curto, who was certainly a slick boxer
     
  7. Sweet Pea

    Sweet Pea Obsessed with Boxing banned

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    The name Hugo Corro ring a bell?
     
  8. Beau Geste

    Beau Geste Active Member Full Member

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    I was waiting for that one! As you must know, when Valdez fought Corro he had been "ruined" by his two fight with Monzon and many other wars. Even after the Monzon beatings he still beat Briscoe a third time. Corro was a very slick and underrated boxer, but certainly you must agree that Valdez was past it when he fought him.
     
  9. redrooster

    redrooster Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    no argument here
     
  10. redrooster

    redrooster Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I must concur and let's not forget Hagler's flesh ripping right jab and excellent defense. The supreme test for Monzon
     
  11. redrooster

    redrooster Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I dissagree. Marvin was not psyched out by Vito as you say. He ran out of gas in the late rounds, a problem he corrected for the Hamsho fight.

    Can't say Hagler was ever psyched out. If he were ever going to be intimidated it would have been by Sibson and Hearns considering the kind of damage they could quickly do to an opponent. And as for leonard, there's a very good reason Leonard came out so suddenly asking for his shot

    I just think the psyched out argument is the wrong one to use here.
     
  12. Sweet Pea

    Sweet Pea Obsessed with Boxing banned

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    Sure, but as you just mentioned immediately after losing to Monzon he managed a third victory over Bennie Briscoe (who, to be fair, was past his best by this time as well). It's not as if he was a shot fighter, in fact physically he still seemed to be in good shape. It was his fighting spirit that seemed lost in those bouts. He simply couldn't put the pedal to the medal when he needed to against a negative pure boxing stylist like Corro. Whether that has to do with his lack of grit or an inability to deal with that kind of mobility, it doesn't speak well for a fight against Hagler. You can talk all you want about all time greats like Leonard and Duran getting in Hagler's head, but the bottom line is he beat at least one, arguably both of those guys, Leonard when he was at the tail end of his career himself. I'll take that over losing twice in uninspired performances to Corro any day of the week.
     
  13. Beau Geste

    Beau Geste Active Member Full Member

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    Hagler himself admitted Duran got in his head. How do you explain the Duran fight in 1983, when Hagler was at his peak?
     
  14. redrooster

    redrooster Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I'm not even picking sides but Hagler to me doesnt seem be the type to be intimidated by another man, especially by a pudgy past his year prime, dimensionally challenged 32 old

    Why wasnt Hagler psyched out by Hearns? Surely Hearns was the superior opponent in terms of height, reach, reflexes, speed, youth, power, peak and much much sharper. Tommy rubbed Duran out and easily outpointed Benitez yet hagler was practically begging for the fight.

    The psyched out argument doesnt work for me. I think how well Hagler performs against Monzon depends on how motivated he would be for him. If he works mechanically with no passion as we sometimes saw (Roldan) then i can see Monzon winning a decision but if he comes out smoking, he could have Monzon back on his heels quickly.

    Remember what happened to Mr Cool, Arguello in the Pryor fight? That's the great thing about Hagler is when he decides to go after someone he can quickly make a wreck out of him (lee, Minter, Hamsho 2, Hearns to name a few)
     
  15. The Morlocks

    The Morlocks Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    back in either the 80's or earlynineties, there was a bio done of Monzon that The Ring talked about and reviewed.:smoke