An opinion on Primo Carnera from 1993

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by BitPlayerVesti, Apr 10, 2021.



  1. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    You are assuming that it is revisionism.

    You could argue that Galico et al were the revisionists, and that people like me are bringing the center of gravity back towards what the fighters and trainers of Carnera's day thought.
     
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  2. Man_Machine

    Man_Machine Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    You could only argue this by inventing your own definition for 'revisionism'.

    There is considerable evidence from people, who actually watched Carnera fight live, describing Carnera's poor performances and limitations - his acknowledged, albeit slight improvement over time, notwithstanding.

    'Gallico et al' were not retrospectively revising an already established position - they were instituting the position, at the time, as events unfolded.
     
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  3. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Now I would have to disagree with your last sentence.

    Gallico et al are secondary sources.

    Why would their testimony count for more than the fighters and trainers of the day?

    I think that if we held the debate on the primary evidence only, that would be to Carnera's advantage, and not to his detractors.
     
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  4. BitPlayerVesti

    BitPlayerVesti Boxing Drunkie Full Member

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    Tommy Loughran as quoted in The Miami News in 01 Mar 1934
    "Carnera is exceptionally fast and clever for a man of his tremendous proportions."
     
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  5. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Why would the opinions of men like Gallico, be given more respect than those of men like Loughran who fought Carnera, and other respected fighters like Max Schmeling or Benny Leonard?

    It makes no sense to me!
     
  6. Man_Machine

    Man_Machine Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Good grief!
     
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  7. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    You would consider a book written after the event, to be a primary source?
     
  8. Kamikaze

    Kamikaze Bye for now! banned Full Member

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    Jan- You think Jim Corbett can beat Tua, Cmon do you really expect to win these arguments on this topic with your rep?
    You are a smart guy surely you understand it is fruitless.
     
  9. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    It is not always about winning the argument.

    You win it if you can, but if you can't, then you at least try to shift the center of the argument.

    Give people some ideas to kick around in the back of their head for a bit!
     
  10. Kamikaze

    Kamikaze Bye for now! banned Full Member

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    Jan- Riddle me this how tf does Jim beat Tua?
     
  11. Kamikaze

    Kamikaze Bye for now! banned Full Member

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    A disturbing truth is that Valuev will inherit the Carnera throne.
     
  12. Man_Machine

    Man_Machine Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    To which book are you referring?
     
  13. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    At the risk of getting off topic, I think that I have given my reasoning multiple primes previously.

    I am genuinely surprised that this is a contentious pick.

    A guy who consistently lost when he stepped up to world level, against a guy who was at least the champion at some point, and was obviously good at not getting hit.

    I assumed that this would look like a somewhat reasonable pick, even to those who didn't see it the same way!

    If you are making Tua a runaway favorite in most fantasy fights, then it is a triumph of fait over experience!
     
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  14. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    The Book of Boxing, by Paul Gallico.
     
  15. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    No he won't.

    Valuev has been given a more than fair shake, and his resume is legitimately lackluster.

    Carnera has been unfairly maligned, and his resume has legitimate merit to it!
     
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