Any good lipreaders? What is Liston saying? "You damn right/well..."

Sure, if you have a chronic history for drink driving, certain actions can be taken - like suspending your drivers licence, if that was an option and enforced back then.

If you’re so bad as to be otherwise trailed and pulled over - it would seem a suspension or permanent cancellation would’ve been put in place in the first instance.

With Liston being legally free to drive, his constantly being pulled over but ultimately found not guilty each and every time could be seen to fall into the category of police harassment -

Also, the number of times Liston might’ve been pulled over and/or arrested on suspicion without any convictions would falsely feed on itself in terms of his public image and the invention of a rep. for chronic drink driving.

I’d like to know the legal alcohol limit, as at the time in Denver, before being deemed as DUI. I suspect it was likely somewhat high as compared to today.

The US limit is basically .08 now, correct? I think we’ve had that limit since the late 1960s and now, since the 1990s, our limit has been .05.

Just on a lighter side note - it was apparently an honour for a cop to pull over Jack Johnson for speeding in his automobile.

One posed photo has Johnson sitting in his car with two cops on bicycles proudly posing alongside the car.

The speed limits were either very low back then or those two cops were insanely fast Olympic cyclists. Lol.

 

Back then, the DWI limit (Driving While Intoxicated) was generally .15 according to my recollection.

 

First, I haven’t seen any citation of how many times Liston actually was arrested (or even pulled over) in Denver.

There seems to be credible reports of Liston reeking of liquor and, iirc, having empty bottles in his car. And he had plenty of other legal issues that included other driving offenses in places other than Denver, right? And are we to believe he was sober here but at the same time buy the stories of him abusing alcohol when training for the second Ali fight — yes, both could be true, but I think it’s more than fair to say Sonny had a documented drinking problem. And a documented driving problem.

As for convictions or not (I think it’s likely in those days, although I don’t know it for sure, that in a lot of places it was an offense that led to a fine more than jail time), I’d rather know the evidence and the testimony. Celebrities, or anyone who can afford high-priced counsel, often get off (do you believe OJ was innocent?).

I’d have to find an expert on Colorado law history to know if they suspended drivers licenses for drunk driving or just took the fine and sent people on their way. (As for blood alcohol level, when did those machines that register that come into use? I really don’t know.)

Regardless, I think the arrest seems likely to have been a good one. There was reason to pull him over and he seems to have been drinking. Maybe he was legally drunk, maybe he wasn’t. But I’d rather anyone caught drinking and driving be off the streets rather than let him go off and kill someone in a drunk driving accident and facing vehicular manslaughter charges.

 

Thanks Kid - that’s big. I’ve seen people at that officially measured level looking very much worse for wear - just on their feet (barely) - let alone getting into a car and driving.

 

There are plenty of variables and consequential actions to be confirmed - and they would need to be firmed up to say it was a good arrest - burden of proof being on the police.

Definitely there are paid defences and powers of influence that can “technically” get people off - people who should’ve been legitimately punished buying their way out.

There’s equally weighted “evidence” to make the case that Liston was inequitably harassed.

Of course this is any comment on the allowance of drink driving in any measure - it should be legitimately policed across the board.

Certainly there have been many instances of police colleagues being let off and anybody else of noted importance, celebrity or clout.

Fortunately, examples of same have been expressly and publicly reversed in more modern times - with more checks and balances in place, including body cam footage.

The old “Do you know who I am?” or flashing of credentials isn’t cutting the mustard anymore.

Just another interesting side note in truth . Someone who was a member of The Masons once told me, as just one of the many one of they secretly communicated to support their “brothers”, that members were instructed to fold their licences in a certain way (back when licences were printed on paper).

So, if by chance you got pulled over by a cop who was also a Mason, the cop would recognise the specific way you folded your licence and let you off.

Alternatively, if you were pulled over by “Crumbs” Molloy, of no known religion though he did worship food, offering him a free packet of Ritz crackers was equally as effective.

 

Lyle's lawyer Walter Gerash got him off. It wasn't an open-and-shut case. When I read the news accounts Lyle sounded guilty of second-degree murder.

 

True. He was a lush and he had poor judgment, especially when drinking. It's also true that the Denver Police Department had a terrible reputation and Snider was a known bad cop. All the cops knew Liston's Cadillac and they used to tail him a lot. No doubt he brought a lot of his problems onto himself.

 

Stricter drunk driving laws and stiffer enforcement in the United States resulted from pressure and lobbying from MADD (Mothers Against Drunk Drving) beginning in the 1980s.

 

Honestly that group in its time was one of the most powerful and influential apolitical lobbying/advocacy groups ever. And it’s hard to argue with their cause … so basically no one did.

 

I remember that clip and wondered what that was all about? Does anyone know? It appears to be after he was out of prison, but what were they hauling him off for? Obviously he's angry and appears to be defending himself about something.

 

Great work!