Are counter punchers glorified among hardcore fans?

I think ur highly underrating Pacquiao's boxing skills. I mean who's the last boxer he has actaully had trouble with? Marquez who happens to be a great boxer/counter puncher, not to mention he's fought with PAcquiao 3 times now and knows his style very well. Pacquiao had his moments countering him and outboxing him too. He outboxed Cotto. I would say he was a bit too reserved in his last fight but Pac's smart enough now not to rush in and get caught with punches he shouldnt be getting caught with.

Isn't that exactly what they did? They turned him from a wild, sloppy one handed fighter to an aggressive two handed boxer-puncher with the ability to counterpunch, and obviously it's had positive results.

 

using the hagler and castillo example would just take us back to fights where it was close that judges would prefer a certain style that dominated more. many people thinks, especially mexicans, that castillo was robbed against floyd but when i scored it, i had it 113-113 draw.

it's not that judges always prefers the aggressor but the trend right now could be judges favoring them in close rounds. it's very easy to say that judges are incompetent or corrupt when a certain decision doesn't approve your own scoring but in these close fights where there are many close rounds, you can expect any scores.

 

:good

 

To answer the TC's question: Yes, I think hardcore fans tend to overrate counterpunching/defensive abilities to some degree, especially when crying robbery.

 

I respect your opinion, but I gotta disagree. Do you honestly think the Castillo and Marquez controversial losses is just a Mexican thing? If that was the case I would be defending Julio Cesar Chavez on his draw on Whitaker everyone including many Mexicans think he lost. That's an absurd excuse or thing to say its a Mexican thing.

I understand what you mean about close fights that might go either way, but can you explain why the majority of fans including many Pacman fans thought Jmm should of gotten the win? And one judge the rookie actually having a fair even card while another had it 116-112? That my friend is a clear example of incompetent judging. The scoring among the 3 judges is not even close. Again, I think they should all take lie detectors to see who they feel really won.

 

This :deal

Hate the way some "hardcore" fans will almost get on a boxing moral high horse about the 'superiority' of counter punchers. Then they cry robbery and claim judges and "casual" fans don't know how to score fights correctly when a counter punchers drops a decision in a close fight to a pressure fighter e.g The Calzaghe Hopkins fight.

 

I don't think Pac would try to out-box Mayweather... but if you're saying that Pac should not second guess himself -- become too "hesitant" (the word you used) -- then a think you make a good point.

As much as possible, Pac should attempt to make his opponents fight his (pac's) fight and NOT the other way around.

 

Well as a thread from the other day emphasized, there aren't many if any defensively sound pressure fighters active today. When Rios is the first name people mention in connection to that description, it's easy to see why those with that style get labeled as lacking skills.

 

100% accurate. [/thread]

 

but you have scored the fight even if i remembered correctly? i don't understand why you think the judges are corrupt and needs to take a lie-detector test when you have it even. did you watched it again and scored the fight to jmm clearly the 2nd time?

many fans thinks jmm deserves the nod since he did more than what was expected of him. i have the same reaction when i watched the fight live but when i rewatched it on a clear copy and scored the fight round by round, i can agree with the judges decision. i have re-watched the fight again yesterday and pac did good in the early rounds and the later rounds.

 

Many also think Marquez won because they know how to score a fight and gave him more rounds than Pacquiao. I don't get why you're so sensitive about people criticizing judges, but have no problem at all attributing ulterior motives or biased scoring on the basis of exceeded expectations alone to those who had Marquez winning.

 

Yes, 99% of fighters and trainers are so inept at scoring they did so for Marquez only because they were not expecting much of him.:nut

This Puga character is a complete clown. He thinks he's fooling people.
This guy is repeatedly day after day saying, "I initially thought Marquez won as well, until I watched a clear copy of it."

Newsflash to this forum idiot. This is 2012 and most people view a fight on HD television nice and clear. He acts as if most people watched it on a bad online stream.

This clown for weeks has repeatedly said, I just watched it again yesterday........Surely if this ******* is repeatedly watching the fight every single day, what else can he be doing that trying to convince himself he did'nt see what he thought he did, and that JMM Royally schooling the fighter who's nuts he's been swinging from for years.

****ing clown had for years been stating, "Marquez could'nt even beat a drained Pacquiao." (referring to fight two)
Now that Marquez shot down that theory with a Bazooka, he watches fight 3 everyday in hopes one day he may finally convince himself Pacquiao was'nt given an education by Marquez.


" I initially though like you did, but I just watched the fight yesterday and I now see what the judges saw.":rofl:rofl:rofl:nut

 

jmm's strategy was to avoid a knockdown at all cost. hence he has move away after his quick counters. even though jmm was the bigger guy at fight night he was not willing to take that risk by engaging pac. he tried in I and II and kissed the canvass. he was just content in scoring brownie points with his counters.

 

corruption is the word. look at jmm's face how it was corrupted..lol

 

you are a complete moron if you think marquez dominated pacquiao. i don't like these approach but since you are taking it too personally, just look at their faces after the fight. you guys don't give pacquiao props for all those punches he landed and some of them are good counterpunches. he played marquez with his game and came out victorious. i'm not trying to convince people like you since i know that you scored all the fights with jmm goggles on. yes you scored it 10-2 or 9-3 on all 3 fights. that's more like scoring with your mexican bias on.

you can whine all day and cry about corrupt judges but at the end of the day, pac's activity and aggression had impressed the judges more than marquez who played it safe the whole night. marquez even said before the fight that he won't let it go to the judges and stop pacquiao.