Are people being overly harsh on Canelo since his loss to Bivol?

It’s only natural that fans take out their frustration for the corruption that permeates Canelo’s team and the corruption that surrounds Canelo, on Canelo. He is given every advantage, judges, ref, fight terms and when he loses it’s only natural for fans to celebrate. He’s the house fighter. The guy you have to beat 10-2 or 11-1 to get a close decision. How can you not detest this slimy corruption if you are a true boxing fan.

Canelo is a cancer on the sport of boxing. Bivol did the world a favor and I hope they fight again so he can drive another nail into the casket

 

Ring size, like when Billy Joe Saunders held up the fight last year and demanded a massive 22 foot ring. Canelo said "no problem" when Diva Saunders did that, you're pretending like Canelo makes unreasonable demands. He fought Bivol at 175 with no catchweight, no rehydration clauses and people are still complaining that he's making unreasonable demands. Fans are never happy, even when Canelo does everything they want him to do, they still cry complain and make up stuff. Some fans are just never satisfied when it comes to Canelo.

That was Oscar's call and Canelo went along with it. Canelo could have overruled DLH but after going against DLH's advice not to fight Mayweather at a weight disadvantage then losing to Mayweather he took DLH's advice that time. He ended up fighting GGG the next year so it's not like he refuse to fight him, just took some time to build himself up to a fight of that magnitude which was smart.

 

Of course, European fans are weird man, no offense to anyone. What I mean is that they are hard wired to support this guy or that guy, and that’s it. So by default because a Canelo beat GGG, they still hold this grudge and always will. Same with Ward (because he beat Froch, Kessler, etc), same with Floyd because he beat Hatton, Manny, etc), on and on it goes. In contrast, Froch beat my favorite fighter, who is literally from my home town, I have no I’ll will towards Froch and became a fan over time. Maybe it’s rooted in the soccer culture or something, I don’t know, I’m not a doctor but it’s a weird dynamic that I do know.

 

Case in point…

 

Comes with the territory of being the top dog. When he was winning were people to overly celebrating his wins? Now that he lost , are people overly harsh? I'd say it s about down the middle. You will have hatters and you will have the fan boys regardless.

 

There's no shame in losing to a guy like bivol the man can box with the best of them. The first thing Canelo needs to do is to get a new team around him he has nothing but yes men around him who have enabled him ignored his flaws and not tried to correct them. His own stubbornness and arrogance finally caught up to him. Second he needs to forget about rematching bivol simply admit he lost to the better man and move on. He's a horrible styles match up for Canelo and I really don't see what canelo can do in a rematch except sell out, which he won't do so forget about him. Third move back down to 168 fight ggg who's a much easier opponent than bivol then charlo and Benavidez in the fight everyone wants to see. If he does those things he can rebuild himself and be right back on the top of the sport.

 

I think there's some push back after some clowns going on about taking on Usyk and other nonsense threads.
The fact is Canelo did take out the champs at 168 but on closer inspection most of them wouldn't have been belt holders in another era's at the weight. If your going to tell me with a straight face that Joe. Andre. James or Roy couldn't walk through the same fights then you really need to educate yourself. That would only impress a complete casual.
I give him props for doing it and for moving up. Let's face it he took Bivol because he thought it would be easier than the other champ with a 100% KO ratio.
These are just the facts. only a complete noob would be fooled by the tactics that the likes of Mayweather or Canelo use to tactically pick fights and stack the odds. You simply can't get around this fact however youu try and spin it.

 

For better or worse, Canelo may go right into a rematch with Bivol to prove a point rather than take the GGG fight coming off a loss. Canelo has not much to gain if he beats GGG, but it is a big $$ fight and the fans want to see it, it's a dangerous fight to go right into coming off the Bivol loss. You don't want to go straight into a GGG fight after that. If he wins a close decision against GGG, it's not going do much other than make GGG and his fans more bitter than they already are. On the other hand, it would be satisfying to put GGG and his fans out of their misery by stopping him or giving him an even worse beating than he dished out in the rematch 4 years ago. So that's the only real upside to it, but coming off a loss it's even more risky to go right into a fight of that magnitude. If he doesn't fight Bivol next, then the smart thing to do is to go back down at 168, fight someone like a Ryder first to get a win under his belt, re-establish himself at that weight then perhaps make the GGG fight. If Bivol wants to fight Canelo at 168 that's another option, or a Benavidez, which probably wouldn't happen till next year because he has a deal with DAZN for 2 more fights.

The problem with fighting anyone other than Bivol next is that he'd be taking a lesser challenge and would be backing down from the biggest challenge of his career. I think at this point, he needs to follow through on the Bivol rematch, even if it ends in another loss, because he knows he faded late in that fight and knows he can make corrections and give a better account of himself next time. He'll also be the underdog this time and he feeds off of proving people wrong. I think that will push him to train harder in the gym and give Bivol a stiffer test in the rematch. Obviously many people have their doubts about whether he can beat Bivol in the rematch, but that uncertainty and doubt is good for the sport. I think Canelo would rather risk another loss than take less challenging fights where he'll be the favorite and be expected to win and can only disappoint. If he wants to move the needle and do something people think he can't do, which is what drives him, he needs to rematch Bivol again. If Bivol wants to challenge him at 168, fight him there, if Bivol makes him fight at 175, fight him there, but this time come in lighter and fix that leaky gas tank. Pace himself better in the early rounds, and have more in the tank to put it on Bivol in the later rounds.

 

Solid post but I think he needs to forget about bivol atleast right now an immediate rematch is a bad idea imo. Still plenty of good options for him to take.

 

Well it's very debatable whether Bivol is an easier fight than Beterbiev. Beterbiev is much older, a bigger puncher for sure but also far easier to outbox and win a decision against than Bivol. Many are picking Bivol to beat Beterbiev after that performance. That said, he and his team may have thought Bivol would be easier than Beterbiev in the sense that he's less dangerous, but when you start comparing Canelo to Mayweather when it comes to taking challenges or stacking the deck it's no comparison. You can't talk about stacking the deck after Canelo did the complete opposite of that by taking on Bivol at his weight with no "deck stacking" stipulations whatsoever. Mayweather would have never taken on this kind of a risk so lets get that straight.

That said, I agree that they did see something in Bivol that they thought they could exploit, but I think it had less to do with that than a failure to execute the gameplan over 12 rounds. The gameplan was working early, even if you disagree on how the rounds were scored, but Canelo just faded and tired as the fight wore on. Full credit to Bivol but Canelo is capable of a better performance than that, at 168 or at 175, but he needs to step up his game, train harder because an OK, B- performance is not going to get it done vs Bivol. Even at his best, he may still lose, or win decision that his haters disagree with, but I'd be surprised if he gives up and doesn't take the rematch. I don't think his competitive spirit will allow himself to back down from the biggest challenge of his career know what I mean? This loss won't sit well with him, and the only remedy is to get back at it and avenge the loss, prove it was just an aberration. That won't be easy to do, but to leave Bivol alone after that keeps him short of the greatness he is seeking.

 

I was beginning to severely dislike Alvarez's career circa Golovkin I but I tend to think people have been extraordinarily critical of him since then. Irrationally so. Since Bivol it's like "I waited all these years to say I told you so." and it's like if you have to wait that long, you're probably talking about a pretty terrific fighter.

 

I understand and I don't blame you for thinking that. It's probably the smarter thing to do to go back down and forget about Bivol but is Canelo Alvarez the kind of guy who will back down from this? His fighting spirit will push him to think he can beat Bivol, and you never know what might happen if he goes back down to 168. If he turns down the rematch he might never get this opportunity again. What will motivate him more than a rematch with Bivol? It's that motivation that drives him. So while it might be smarter to follow your path, the true glory he seeks is not by taking the path of least resistance but by walking through fire and trying to slay the dragon that is Dmitry Bivol.

 

I understand what you are saying but that assessment is based on hindsight. before the fight Beterbiev is seen as the more dangerous fighter due to knocking out everyone as a Pro. Also styles makes fights the fact Bivol confortably beat Canelo doesn't mean that he suddenly beats Beterbiev. Yes Beterbiev is getting older but he's low ileage in pro fights and hasn't been in loads of wars.
I agree Canelo's team obviously thought they could gameplan and exploit something in Bivol's game and they knew that Bivol hadn't knocked anyone out for several years. so at least lower risk in not getting really hurt or ko'd.
I'm not sure I agree with your next paragreph. I think Canelo can perform better but I think he now has issues with speed and enfurance. The fact is he's a short arse and carryting muscle works if opponents are plodding or static with low output. he has skill but against someone with equal skill and more speed and movement he would struggle even at 168. This is why I don't rate the run at Super Middle as hughly as you do. still an achievement the context being not great quality that was largely untested.
Mostly I agree with you on this post it seems reasonable.

 

I’m with pimp on this one that pride sh!t get you best tf up, Just based off history Canelo will likely take an immediate rematch but should have kept that win vs Kovalev and ran with it.
Maybe more ppl might pick them now but no one serious thinks Charlo or Benavidez or GGG can beat Canelo at 168 and considering he gets accused of ducking all 3 all it would take is whooping them to make everybody forget about Bivol.
I mean realistically Bivol could very well get his a$$ whooped by Beterbiev, Canelo not no light heavyweight credit to him for taking the risk but he don’t need that smoke and I say that as somebody who in my youth would fight damn near anybody you still gotta know ya limits and when to charge it to the game

 

People are ridiculous when it comes to Canelo. Canelo is an all time great, one of the best ever and an exciting fighter to watch. Some fans get salty and hold Canelo accountable for judging they don’t agree with. Canelo isn’t a boxing judge!

People were desperate for Canelo to have a clear loss and not get a decision. He dared to be great and came up short on this occasion. People want to try and pretend that Bivol schooled Canelo, when it was really a very close fight other than a couple of later rounds where Canelo looked gassed. Bivol landed very little himself. I wouldn’t rule out Canelo in the rematch even though I favour Bivol to win it again with his beautiful jab and distance control.

The question here I have is why do fans get so hung up on what the judges decide? It’s a subjective sport. Canelo didn’t decide his own fights. If judges give Maidana the decision against Floyd does that change what happened in the ring, do we then get mad at Maidana for the decision? I find it all very strange and illogical.