Are Peter's new boxing skills going to turn against him?

His boxing skills are only going to make him stronger. There were some problems last night and none of them had anything to do with Sam throwing a double jab.

Namely he did not respect McCline's power. He walked in with his hands down which is a tremendous mistake. If McCline was a decent finisher Sam would have been KO'd. Once Sam realized that McCline could deck him he became more defensive and started throwing the jab more. Which he should have been doing in the first round.

The other factor in this fight was that McCline borrowed from Waldo's cheat of leaning in and grabbing on the inside. There is really nothing the smaller man can do to stop this. The only person who can, and who should have, was Robert Ortega. He did a disgustingly bad job last night of moderating the clinches. Everytime Sam tried to go downstairs in close McCline grabbed and pulled him close, to suffocate the punches.

Of course it worked, it works everytime anyone tries it. Which is how John Ruiz as mediocre as he is went on to be an established champion.

King, Duva and the NYSAC really dropped the ball as far as I'm concerned. I've lost all respect for them insofar as how they handle clinching. They should have learned from the Waldo fight that all these big guys are going to do is punch and grab. It's cheap, very effective and illegal. Go back in history and look at how guys like Fraizer and Tyson and others were beaten by the clinch. It's difficult for a smaller man to deal with. And the bigger the offender, the more impossible it becomes.

 

Exposed by Jameel DeCline!
Peter was obviously over-confident.
He lost a lot of his "intimidation" power he's now perceived as vunerable.
A healthy Maskaev might have knocked him out of the ring.

 

They did against McCline - 3 times!

 

anytime you fight a guy that much taller than you, you will get hit more often...Peter's defence isn't any worse than it already was, and Peter using his jab can only help improve his game...had Peter fought McCline like he fought Wlad, he would've got KTFO...

 

Sorry but I will never accept it as anything other than a cheap way of winning a fight.

Holyfield holding Tyson isn't as offensive as a guy 6'6 260lbs holding and leaning on a guy who is 6'1. Granted, I would have taken points from Holyfield too! That said, we're talking about two guys evenly matched in height and weight.

And Ali was no different. Call him the greatest, I'll call him an opportunist. Fraizer woulda beat his ass from here to tomarrow had he been warned/penalized about his holding.

Clinching excessively is NOT a part of boxing and is only excuseable under certain athletic commissions and refs/officials. It needs serious consideration or this sport is doomed to being overrun by boxers who will use every trick/CHEAT in the book to come out on top. John Ruiz is a perfect example of this.

I haven't rewatched the fight yet, but I will. And when I do I will tally up how many times McCline stepped in and smothered Peter with the clinching. We'll see.

 

Clinching seems to be a big issue with you. What's your standard (per round) for excessive clinching?

 

:-(

 

If left to me clinching would only be excuseable as a means to survive, post knockdown.

If you feel dazed and certain the next few punches will get you, then take a knee.

If you have already been dropped, then a series of clinches inside is excuseable.

But if you clinch prior to the knockdown, or the round after being dropped, then it needs to be considered as heavy a foul as a low blow. Give 2 warnings then start taking points. A disqualification should be at the discretion of the referee. Everything else should be taken by the book.

 

You fight your way out of a clinch with body shots and hooks and uppercuts to the head. Or you do it by pushing your opponent off of you and hitting him immediately after that.

All this whining about poor Peter being clinched so much sounds like one big excuse. Somebody has to stop the Peter excuse-mania

 

Look through history and you'll find alot of examples that have nothing to do with Sam Peter.

And have you ever been in a boxing ring and fought the jab and grab? You have no idea how difficult it is when someone is doing it right. And even worse when that someone has a significant size advantage.

It's the only way to truely govern it. Some boxers are using the clinch as a substitute for an inside gameplan. Even Steward has told his boxers in the past to hold when the opponent is on the inside. Lewis was a big offender of this, and so is Waldo.

Limiting the clinch to post-knockdown would get rid of this strategy. It would do alot for boxing to make it a more entertaining sport and to make these heavyweights train harder.

Do you ever wonder why the lighter weights are not filled with this same sort of behavior? Evenly matched opponents in size usually have something to do with it. Clinching becomes harder when your opponent is as long as you. But a gigantic heavyweight has a considerably easy time with a smaller heavyweight if he just abandons an inside fight and opts to grab instead. John Ruiz in particular made up for the size difference by blatantly jumping in and smothering his opponents. He was by far the worst offender.

We all have seen what happens to John Ruiz when he doesn't clinch. He gets beat rather easily. But he managed to get by several boxers who were much better than him because of the clinching. And in the process eroded some basic quality associated with the glamour division.

 

On the clinching issue, I think we can all agree that John Ruiz for example used it exessively.
Ruiz actually used the clinch while his opponent actually tried to duck and evade him to set up a counter.
Jab, miss, clinch, jab, miss, clinch.....Ruiz did this over and over again.
That friends is illegal, and inexplicably (exept for Jay Nady in the Jones fight) the refs for most of Ruiz' fights have done absolutely nothing to stop Ruiz from clinching and grabbing a fighter who is actually stepping away (not toward him)


Having said that, I do believe that clinching is and should be part of boxing.
Holyfield-Tyson for example......most of those clinches were a result of both fighters stepping toward eachother and wanting the same position.
A case of two fighters stepping toward eachother aggressively, and a clinch resulting. That is just part of the game and is not illegal.

In many cases, a fighter like Tyson explodes foward toward a fighter, and in the midst of a miss, smacks his weight and shoulders full force toward his opponent.
The fighter on the recieving end having felt the force behind Tyson trying to ram through him after having missed a punch, really has no choice but to brace and clinch if he can when he see's Tyson again attempting the same thing.

Clinching in these instances should'nt be penalized.


On the McCline clinching Peter issue, imo I dont believe McCline held exessively.
What is a big guy like McCline who does'nt have a whole lot of leg manueverability to do, when he is driven back and Peter gets up close to throw a bomb????
In most instances, McCline braced and actually threw with Peter and then a clinch resulted.
I did'nt see anything exessive as far as McCline clinching.

If a smaller more agile fighter can run all night and avoid exchanges, why the hell cant a big guy use his assets and use his weight to lean on a fighter if the little guy wants rest time.
If the smaller man does'nt want to get leaned on, he can use his damn legs to see to it that they dont lean on him.

A long as its the in the context of trying to establish a real offense, I see nothing wrong or illegal of a fighter using his weight to his advantage to lean on a fighter.