Are the past Eras overrated or the new generation just not that good?

Floyd Patterson would handily beat Anyone around today (even my man Usyk), not even imagining what Liston would do to them!

And Ali? He would be dancing around all these guys, laughing and insulting and whupping them the whole time.

 

Patterson and Liston get whooped.

 

Funny stuff!

 

What are you talking about?

Are you trolling?

Frazier was undefeated going into their first fight.

Foreman was undefeated.

Liston had only lost once on a decision when he was young, where he was fighting just about every month.

Unless you think the Liston fight/fights were fixed, then they were great wins.

Both Frazier and Foreman are ATG HW’s, and everyone thought that Ali was on a suicide mission against Foreman.

I don’t understand why you’re making these silly claims, whilst at the same time, you’re telling everyone that nobody could beat Tyson Fury. But then if we play your game, who has he beaten to make you believe this?

 

Ha!

Been on BoxRec?

 

This is what Ali would be doing to these big chumps nowadays, laughing, talking, dancing & beating the livin' crap outta all of 'em!

 

They all lost to bums though, everyone is undefeated til they get beaten. The fact is they lost to bums, therefore they are overrated. If Fury had lost to someone of the calibre of Garcia what would you be saying about Fury? You'd be saying he was a bum and deserves no mention amongst the heavyweights of the past.

 

Yes, a pretty good place to go when checking the records of fighters. You should have a look on there yourself.

 

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Provided he doesn't come up against the likes of Henry Cooper and those other bums who flattened him. He'd probably also be having his gloves cut quite a lot when the going got tough.

 

Look at Furys resume though. Had Ali retired after getting banned from boxing he'd have been undefeated and still possessing the better record than Fury.

Larry Holmes was undefeated for several years and dominated the division unlike Fury but he kept fighting and eventually declined, then lost. While Fury has the chance to fight the winner of Usyk/Joshua, he instead retires because he doesn't want to risk a loss. Undefeated or not that resume is good but not great worthy. He's a very good fighter though.

 

To be fair McDermott was never considered very good at all and on most people's scorecards (including mine) he lost to him. Fury was like 21 though

 

You obviously rate the wins based on where they all were at the time.

That is the objective thing to do.

You can also look at what they went onto do afterwards.

You make allowances for certain circumstances, like if they were young, or really faded or shot etc.


On the way up, Manny Pacquiao was knocked out by a guy you’ve never heard of.


Tyson Fury was exceptionally lucky not to have lost to John McDermott in their first fight.

Again, I’m Tyson’s biggest fan. But I watched that fight, and I don’t believe that he won.

John McDermott was a good fighter, but he was a domestic/European level fighter. He wasn’t world class.


I could ask you who Tyson’s ever beaten to be regarded so highly by you.


If you said Wilder, I could say to you:

“Wilder has beaten no great fighters, and all his wins are B level wins, in a weak resume where he’s struggled against C class guys”


If you said it was Wlad, I could say to you:

“He was knocked out by a Euro level fighter, as well as 2 other non great fighters before Tyson fought him”


If you use your current ranking criteria that you’re using for Ali, then you can’t possibly rate Tyson so highly, where you don’t think that he could ever have been beaten.

 

So what's your take on Fury? Think he's overrated?

 

The point is:

Unless you’ve watched the fights, they don’t give you any context.

 

I think that he’s great.

He’s unique.

However, I was just trying to explain to G Man that it’s silly to suggest that he’s unbeatable.

Every fighter has a stylistic nemesis.

There’s simply no such thing as the perfect fighter.

I tried to explain to him that even Tyson would struggle against certain styles, but he doesn’t believe so.

It’s just silly. Especially as Tyson himself will tell you that Steve Cunningham was his toughest stylistic match up.

Some of these guys don’t realise that his huge frame would actually put him at a disadvantage in some fights.