Arum is killing the sport big time. He said "Chavez vs Margarito is bigger then

Who calls Chavez a prospect? He's not the finished article and will improve like wise, to use another example Khan isn't the finished article and he's also not a prospect.

Chavez Jr (like Snr) never had an amateur background hence the inflated record, in real terms he's nearer to being a decent amateur with a 25-0 record than a real 44-0-1-1 type record. This seems to be forgotten by many.

Again Chavez's best interest lie with himself getting the most money for the least risk. Whilst you might want to see him beaten up he'd be ******ed to take a fight he'd be a big under-dog in for less money than he can get by beating up chumps. Think he cares about a nobody on the internet saying he doesn't have a mexican warrior heart? Having a mexican warrior heart doesn't buy houses, pay bills, buy nice cars etc.

 

I have no problem with Chavez vs Margarito seems like a good fight to me. People need to stop feeling bad for Sergio if he wanted a big fight that bad he can always go up in weight

 

Simple, no amateur experience, still very young and he's NOT his father. ...although TBH would you say Mayweather back then was on par with Martinez of today?

 

See I don't really think he has that much. He looked great tonight against a guy who doesn't even belong on Friday Night Fights anymore. He looked like the same old guy in June.

You're starting threads ogling about his "second longest active win streak." I'm sorry people want him to step up as a result.

I have little doubt that Sulaiman does not want that fight to actually happen but the extent to which he's repeatedly and publicly indicated it will be mandated makes me think he's too committed on this issue. Several times in the past 3-4 months, he's reiterated that there will be no obstacles placed in front of Martinez, even when people were publicly expecting him to (e.g., in response to the comment that "Rubio-Martinez would be an exciting fight"). Now if anyone is going to do their best to keep this from happening, it's HBO. Davis has several times said that this is a fight that doesn't need to happen, so I'm sure they could cook something up like "not buying the fight." That said, I don't see the WBC taking the heat on this one.

Additionally, Arum's desperation to make Alvarez-Chavez or even Oscar-Chavez now lol also strikes me as circumstantial evidence that they're going to need a good reason not to do the Martinez fight. Finally, I have no idea why you're spouting off about the importance of business in boxing and then implying that Martinez is ducking Pirog.

 

Martinez, Sturm, Pirog and Jikam all beat Chavez jr. Hell even Zbik has an excellent shot at a rematch.

 

Personally I thought he looked much better than the guy who stood toe to toe with Zbik and brawled. Tonight he actually boxed, he jabbed, he moved, he used hi head and his feet.

The streak is more looking at how easy it is to create long unbeaten runs. It's not a matter of "wow he's beat a list of hall of famers", but he has beaten some very credible fighters (which is often ignored)

Sulaiman can say anything repeatedly, it's not hard for him to say something but actions speak louder than words. He'll find a way to keep Sergio and Chavez apart. Could be that he role switches them and Segio v Rubio is for the title and Chavez becomes Emeritus or something equally backwards. HBO will likely wait until Chavez is an accepted PPV name before they attempt to force the issue, they, like Arum, Sulaiman, Martinez and Chavez will want to line their pockets as much as possible.

If Martinez is that desperate for either a title or a fight why not fight the guys that want him was what I was getting at. He can't complain about one man ducking him when others feel he is ducking them. It's just a bit hypocritical to me to expect someone with no chance of beating you to take the risk when you won't accept other fighters challenges. I'm not implying Martinez is ducking Pirog (even though thats the fight I want at middleweight) but that would be the top 2 dogs in the division, it would be two prime fighters, it would IMO be the most significant fight in the division...and Martinez would earn more credit for beating Pirog than he would for beating "the joke" Chavez.

 

You completely avoided my question so lets try again, would you have Mayweather that faced Chavez Sr on par with Martinez? Would Mayweather in 1989 have been a top 10p4p fighter?

Chavez may want to fight the best, just not yet.

 

No love for Proksa? Golovkin?

 

Yes, Proksa and Golovin also beat Chavez Jr. Chavez Jr is a decent fighter but mostly hype. He's very beatable.

 

Right but his boxing skills were on display against a slow plodder who can't even box full time these days. Forgive me if I dock points for level of compeition.

Please list these very credible fighters. The only one that I would describe as "very credible" is Molina, who was robbed once and arguably hosed a second time.

Pirog is arguably as much a prospect as Chavez, has a belt as paperthin as Chavez's, and has defeated the same number of top 10 middleweights as Chavez (less than him if you count Zbik!). He's by no means clearly the second best in the divsion, nor would a win do much for Martinez's resume or legacy. My point was though, for all your talk of boxing business, how does it make any sense to call out Martinez for not fighting Pirog when the latter has a belt that rightfully belongs to Martinez (great, he can pay sanctioning fees to the body that stripped him 5 weeks after he won it the first time!), has no name value in the US, and is only capable of bringing in any kind money in hostile territory that won't receive HBO coverage?

 

He was still boxing as opposed to brawling like he usually would. Zbik stood still in front of him and looked plodding late on but yet at not point did we see Chavez box (he did against Duddy though and looked good back then).

Molina (as you said), Duddy (was top 10 or so), Lyell (tough but always game and comes to win), Zbik (great win in all honest).

Pirog has great amateur background, and has ALWAYS been tested as a professional, whilst he's not had a lot of fights you can go through his record and see that he's fought very tough competition time and time again. He's also in his 30's so IMO not a prospect, he's at his physical peak. Same number of top 10 fighters? Hmm maybe but he's fought a lot of top 15-20 type guys (jantuah, Ajetovic, Kodzoev, Jacobs and Maciel would give anyone fits). HBO knows fans say him destroy Jacobs and has had other fights (Maciel) shown on US TV, he's known to US audiences.

Again though, it's the hypocrisy of "I can't be avoided...despite avoiding others"

 

**** Arum