ATG FEATHERWEIGHT TOURNIE: QF 1 - WILLIE PEP UD15 EUSEBIO PEDROZA

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Jun 3, 2020.


Who will win?

Poll closed Jun 6, 2020.
  1. Pep

    81.3%
  2. Pedroza

    18.8%
  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Both men cleanly out-boxed their opposition in the first round - who wins this clash of the tough-guy master-boxers in the first of the Quarter Finals?

    Here is a list of the made men that Willie Pep (seeded 1) defeated:

    Ray Famechon, Charley Riley, Eddie Compo, Sandy Saddler, Humberto Sierra, Jock Leslie, Jackie Graves, Sal Bartolo, Phil Terranova, Charles Lewis, Manuel Ortiz and Chalky Wright.

    It is a longer list of ranked contenders or significant scalps taken than any other featherweight in history by measure.

    But it was the manner in which he bested them that really sets him apart.

    Willie Pep was not a technician in the strictest of terms; his style is not one that should ever be taught to prospective pugilists. That would be like asking a nine year old with good spatial awareness to equal the Mona Lisa. Rather, Pep was fundamentally sound, in that he rarely if ever overstretched his physical abilities during technical execution, the definition of fistic legitimacy.

    The reality was perfection even if the technique was sometimes questionable. What I mean by this is that he did things that would be deemed imperfect in the strictest sense of technical excellence but those things yielded impossible results. It is not enough to say “he got away with it” – he re-defined “it” for his own ends, like all true mavericks.

    Based primarily upon this disturbing mixture of sound and unsound footwork, which both removed him from and introduced him to punching range depending upon his needs, Pep worked to the tiniest of margins, perfect for inducing foolish risks in otherwise sound opponents, but failing to translate somewhat to the bigger divisions against fighters with longer reaches – Pep’s best was, inarguably, at featherweight.

    He feinted with those feet, boxing high on his toes whether pivoting, coming in or coming out, coming down only when it was safe for him to do so. But Pep hacked boxing’s Matrix. It was safe for him to punch when mortal fighters had to cover up. Pep, more any other fighter, boxed in perfect harmony with his body, dancing to a tune nobody else could hear.

    All this birthed perhaps the greatest hot-streak in boxing: 135-1-1, with neither draw nor loss coming at featherweight.

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    Eusebio Pedroza (seeded 9), out of Panama City, was at once an elegant, skillful boxer and an aggressive, rough-house mauler, the kind of offshoot you might get if you tried to splice Willie Pep with Sandy Saddler.

    Perhaps the most complete featherweight in the tournie, Pedroza’s career is, by contrast incomplete. Pedroza lifted the WBA title in 1978; Salvador Sanchez reigned as the WBC and lineal champion. The WBA and WBC refused to let their champions face one another; in other words, the governing bodies who are supposed to regulate boxing’s betterment denied us the chance of seeing Sanchez-Pedroza, certainly the greatest featherweight fight never to be made, furthermore denying Pedroza the chance to fight for the lineal title and to meet the only man in the world who could contest his dominance. “Worse than useless” is the phrase you are looking for.

    When Sanchez tragically passed it was Pedroza who picked up the pieces, lifting the lineal title in 1983. He managed just four defenses of this, the legitimate title.

    His standing among the greatest featherweights is, nevertheless, guaranteed. He knocked off numerous contenders, as famous for his otherworldly stamina as for his viciousness, two attributes partly responsible for victories over the likes of Jose Caba, Rocky Lockridge, Pat Ford, Ruben Olivares, Hector Carrasquilla and Cecilio Lastra. Very much the scourge of the division upon the passing of Sanchez, if he was occasionally drawn into close and even controversial wars that ended in narrow decisions in his favor he was more often dominant and deadly.
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    Who will win under the following rules?

    15 round fight.
    1950s referee.
    8oz boxing gloves.
    10 points must.

    Cast your vote and explain yourself in a post below! You have 3 days.
     
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  2. mark ant

    mark ant Canelo was never athletic Full Member

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    Wow Pedroza looks like my dad when he was young in this pic.
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  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Fair old tache on him, looks slick as ****.
     
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  4. Saad54

    Saad54 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Pep has the footspeed to give Pedroza fits. Pep W 15.
     
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  5. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    I don't think it's within the realms of realistically probability that Pep gets outboxed.

    There's been a few defensive wizards in history, but even in that small elite group, few were as dedicated to their craft as Pep.

    Physically overwhelming is something that can happen to anyone, but punch by punch out boxing Pep, I just don't see it.

    Pedroza is too technical for his own good here and will see him fall short.

    Pep UD.
     
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  6. Berlenbach

    Berlenbach Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Pedroza is a live underdog here, tough, very savvy, dirty as hell, so if he can **** Pep off and drag him into a brawl like Saddler his odds improve.

    Then again, Bernard Taylor, who was no Willie Pep, did a pretty good job boxing Pedroza, who struggled to catch up to him (fight was a draw). He also had a few other close calls (like Lockridge), whereas nobody could really touch Pep at feather prior to Saddler.

    Ultimately, I'll go with Pep's class and he wins on points.
     
  7. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Pep UD, but it's close.
     
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  8. Clinton

    Clinton Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    No Kos here. I'll go with the consensus and take the Will 'O the Wisp
     
  9. robert ungurean

    robert ungurean Богдан Philadelphia Full Member

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    As much as I like Pedroza I dont see him getting the job done. I got Pep in a close competitive UD.
     
  10. greynotsoold

    greynotsoold Boxing Addict

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    I've always thought that Saddler defeated Pep by making him lose his composure. Saddler fought rough and he was strong enough to manhandle him in the clinches. The fight that Pep won was a master class, I've read, and I guess that was because Pep kept his focus and fought his fight.
    Pedroza certainly fought rough enough but I think Pep would pay him back and fight his fight. After all, only Saddler got over on him in that way, beat him that way. It won't be an easy fight but I figure Pep wins a decision.
     
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  11. Drew101

    Drew101 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I think Pedroza wouldn't necessarily be able to outbox Pep, per se...But I can see him boxing well enough to keep it close on the cards going into the championship rouns, while getting enough...uh...business done in close to ensure that he might be able to wear down Pep enough where he patented late rounds rally could make the difference.

    Don't blame anyone who picks Pep, but I think Pedroza is one of the few featherweights with the skill and...know-how...to be able to pull off the upset.

    Pedroza close UD.
     
  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Agree. Pedroza is filthy enough to create aspects of what Saddler fed him.
     
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  13. Jester

    Jester Active Member Full Member

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    I think for Pedroza to recreate the kind of success Saddler had mauling Pep he would have to largely forsake his boxer-puncher style and attempt a sustained high volume attack and that just wasn't the type of fighter he was. Pedroza was best using his height to impose himself, slipping punches and using his jab to give himself breathing room. Pedroza was an expert at roughhousing and he could do some damage on the inside, but I see Pep boxing his way to a close decision, probably in the 8-7 range.
     
  14. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    Pedroza has some of the attributes required, and I’ve not seen Pep outbox someone as big and as with as brilliant a jab + his own brilliant range management as Pedroza had.

    But Pedroza had iffy performances pre, during and post-prime against a variety of styles. I’ll go with the guy that barely lost in his prime and never lost at featherweight in his prime. Pep by decision in a competitive fight.
     
  15. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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    It's a Pep decision for me. I think his speed gets him home but there'd be some tough rough stretches in there. Pedroza also lacks that big big power Saddler had.