ATG? Juan Manuel Marquez?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019.


Is he?

  1. Yes

    10 vote(s)
    52.6%

  2. No

    9 vote(s)
    47.4%
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  1. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft He Who Saw The Deep Full Member

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    Would you class him as one? Personally I wouldn't.
    To me an ATG is someone who makes my top 100 pfp, or top 10 in a weight class or someone inspirational/important ie. Mike Tyson and Jack Dempsey both don't make my top 10 HWs but both are ATGs. For me Marquez doesn't do any of those.
     
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    #1
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  2. roughdiamond

    roughdiamond Ridin' the rails... Full Member

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    Gonna have a lot of debate on this.

    To me, he's a very good fighter (one level below ATG) with an ATGs number (not conclusively may I add).
     
    roughdiamond, Aug 11, 2019
    roughdiamond, Aug 11, 2019
    #2
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  3. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft He Who Saw The Deep Full Member

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    Exactly my thoughts.

    Although KO6 is about as conclusive as it gets. Lol
     
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    #3
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  4. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster On the Italian agenda Full Member

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    He's JUST below my top 100 P4P but I'm probably selling him short. I know he's on McGrain's so he's in the discussion no doubt.
     
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Aug 11, 2019
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Aug 11, 2019
    #4
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  5. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft He Who Saw The Deep Full Member

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    I think he is just short of an ATG ability wise. He faced 3 imo and only had real success against 1.

    He was shut out by Mayweather and lost a close fight to John, who's a borderline ATG anyway. His fights with Pacquiao are what his legacy will be defined by.

    If you use your own cards his résumé shoots up massively as you can in theory give him all 4 Pacquiao fights and the John fight. But officially he's got 2 good wins and 1 was past prime
     
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    #5
  6. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I just don't see what so many others see in this guy. I have my share of blind spots certainly, but I really don't see him being appreciably better than his brother. I really don't. His entire reputation is built on the Pacquiao fights.
     
    salsanchezfan, Aug 11, 2019
    salsanchezfan, Aug 11, 2019
    #6
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  7. Bronze Tiger

    Bronze Tiger Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I challenge anyone to name 100 fighters better than him ...if you say you can you’re probably biased ...( and try to name 50 guys we have no footage of please)
     
    Bronze Tiger, Aug 11, 2019
    Bronze Tiger, Aug 11, 2019
    #7
  8. Bronze Tiger

    Bronze Tiger Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Let me see that top ten heavyweights list ..
     
    Bronze Tiger, Aug 11, 2019
    Bronze Tiger, Aug 11, 2019
    #8
  9. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    You're saying there aren't 100 guys through history that would have beaten Chris John?
     
    salsanchezfan, Aug 11, 2019
    salsanchezfan, Aug 11, 2019
    #9
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  10. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft He Who Saw The Deep Full Member

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    1. Muhammad Ali
    2. Joe Louis
    3. Lennox Lewis
    4. George Foreman
    5. Larry Holmes
    6. Wladimir Klitschko
    7. Joe Frazier
    8. Sonny Liston
    9. Evander Holyfield
    10. Jack Johnson
     
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    #10
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  11. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    And yes, I know that's an oversimplification, but......
     
    salsanchezfan, Aug 11, 2019
    salsanchezfan, Aug 11, 2019
    #11
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  12. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft He Who Saw The Deep Full Member

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    There definitely are 100 guys him beat him. From LW to FW there is Definitely a 100 guys.
    I'm the person to name them coz 1. I can't be arsed and 2. I don't know as much as others here about them weights.
    But I'm confident in saying 100 guys could do it
     
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    #12
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  13. emallini

    emallini Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Of course he is
     
    emallini, Aug 11, 2019
    emallini, Aug 11, 2019
    #13
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  14. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft He Who Saw The Deep Full Member

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    By my standards?
     
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    George Crowcroft, Aug 11, 2019
    #14
  15. Bronze Tiger

    Bronze Tiger Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I’ll bet there are 100 guys that could have beaten Rubin Carter as well
     
    Bronze Tiger, Aug 11, 2019
    Bronze Tiger, Aug 11, 2019
    #15
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