ATG Middleweight Chin Tier list-The Top Forty

Yeah, possibly. It was brutal.

As a note, I tend to think Zale's durability is overestimated by most, as a side effect of his nickname "Man of Steel".

 

Difficult - because Zale could clearly ship some leather, at times, but his first-round KO against Jimmy Clark puts a big dent in the potential of an 'Iron' rating, for mine.

 

Carlos Monzon, decked by only Jorge Fernandez in 1966, South American title but arose to win that bout, and Rodrigo Valdes on July 30 1977 in Monte Carlo, Monaco in his 14 th and final defense, Monzon got up immediately to win a unanimous 15 round decision to retain his title, then retired as champion on August 29 1977. Monzon was champion from Nov 7 1970 until August 29 1977.

 

Just iron for me. He was a tough guy but very hittable and hurtable. I view him in a similar light as Gatti and Vargas. Willing to fight to the death but limited defensively and doesn't have the best whiskers.

 

Zale is a strange one. Did his chin get better throughout his career or did he just get better?

Stoppage losses to the unremarkable Roughouse Glover and Jonny Phagan can be mitigated to an extent by the fact they were just before Zale's 22nd birthday and he'd only had 20-something fights.

Down 3 times and stopped in the first round vs the equally unremarkable Jimmy Clark (12 stoppage wins in his 39 fights) in his 41st fight, aged almost 25, isn't a good look, though.

Zale did subsequently fight far better fighters and bigger punchers without being stopped, though, including Al Holstak and Fred Apostoli.

On balance, I'd guess Zale's chin as solid.

 

I could only see Conn as iron or titanium, the question is, which?

It's difficult because Conn didn't fight at MW for long, with Krieger and Apostoli (obviously Zale could whack too, but Conn was a fully fledged LHW by then) the only notable opponents who were both world class MWs and decent punchers.

So, to a large degree we are reliant on extrapalating Conn's performance at higher weights, vs the likes of Louis and Savold, and other lower quality, but nevertheless, physically much bigger, boxers, and guessing as to the extent of his, no doubt excellent, punch resistance when weighing around 160lbs.

Whilst I think Conn has an argument for a titanium chin from a p4p perspective, given the lack of evidence of how his punch resistance was whilst Conn himself was a MW, I'll err on the side of caution and vote for iron.

I'd have no problem with a titanium ranking though, I'd have sat on the fence if it wasn't for the fact I didn't feel that would be in keeping with the spirit of this excellent thread.

 

I'll fall on the side of a 'Solid' rating for Zale, as well.

 

A slim record against MWs, few if any of whom were punchers, means we need to be somewhat guided by Conn's LHW career, as well as his crack at HW.

Given Conn wasn't taken out from '38 to '40 and didn't do too bad against the bigger guys until he ran into Louis, the benefit of the doubt at MW is fairly easy to give.


Conn = 'Titanium'

 

I'd have no quarms about that. If Toney makes it off his work at higher weights, so should Conn.

I would say, though, I do think Toney showed a better chin than Conn did by a decent bit. Conn taking bombs of Joe ****in Louis is insane.

 

Zale - Solid
Conn - Iron