ATG Rank: Pacquiao, Canzoneri, Ross, McLarnin

The reason casual fans rank Pacquaio so highly is mainly due to him winning 7 titles in 7 weight classes, i mean to put that in perspective, Oscar De La Hoya won 6 titles in as many weight classes, arguably took harder fights than Pacquaio and didn't spend the majority of his career picking on smaller men, and nobody is banging on about Oscar being top 30 atg.

The 'journeyman' you refered to as handing McLarnin a savage beating was Ray Miller, the only man that holds a KO victory over McLarnin and a man that also holds wins over Billy Petrolle & Sid Terris amongst others. Miller was one tough SOB an was only stopped once in his whole career, and you also have to consider McLarnin came back 4 months later an avenged that defeat.

Off course fighters of the past lost more than the average great boxer now adays, they constantly fought the best available opposition, sometimes with only weeks between bouts.

 

Look at the quality of fighter he was facing year in and year out..its silly to suggest he wouldnt, a lot of those losses were razor thin or at the start or end of his career.

I dont know about these journeyman.

Ray Miller was a top 10 ranked contender for over 5 years...McLarnin avenged that defeat.

Billy Petrolle is an ATG puncher at lightweight and has one of the best resumes of that era for someone who was never a champ..Jimmy avenged that blip twice.

Bud Taylor is a top 10 Bantamweight great.

Johnny Farr had a patchy record, thats true but he was very well respected and was matched multiple times against the very best of the era, he bagged a few titles shots aswell..Jimmy was also barely 19 for that and Snell bout I think.

Broullierd was younger, bigger and ended up being a 2 weight champion.

Thats not true...and you dont ignore everything else. It depends on what you like more but personally I think the best wins on your resume should count for the most, you certainly factor in other things but for me I factor them in a little less.
You are never going to be totally consistent, thats why these lists can be a little silly but they are fun and you can learn a hell of a lot whilst making them.

That list borders on farcical and isnt well respected.

They have Khaosai Galaxy over Roy Jones, Tommy Hearns, Jose Napoles, Carlos Ortiz among others...do you agree with that?

McLarnin beat 13 world champions and nearly as many actual HOFamers, Ill check the number..Pac's got a bit of a way to go before he can match that, so I dont really factor it in as much.
I have them about the same, if anything Pac a bit higher..so Im not really into counting up wins on paper.

He is on the same level of Hagler and Monzon IMO, in that very stacked and blurry 20-35 range. Some may have him over Pea, I can dig that but I dont personally.
I do not have him over Leonard, who IMO has better top shelf wins anyway.

 

Well whats your reason for ranking pernell above mclarnin, he doesnt have the 'wins resume' that mclarnin possess. Hell I would say pac has a better resume than whitaker.

 

atsch

 

I consider the Chavez fight a win, I also consider the first Ramirez fight a win along with the Nelson fight that brings him pretty high on the resume department.

With Pea Im being inconsistent...I consider him so great because those others factors, he scores so well. His form on film and in the ring dominance is about as good as Ive seen. He is probably the best pure boxer Ive laid my eyes on and have seen a good catalogue of fights.

As Ive said I dont totally ignore those things and only factor them in slightly less where possible but its not as though Pea is completely out of his depth in terms of resume at the high end of alltime rankings.

But Pea is an anolomy that Ill freely admit doesnt quite fit in with the usual criteria I go with...Im like that with Pryor, Jones, Mayweather and Fenech aswell.

 

Villa, Labarba, Ambers, Canzoneri, Ross, Kaplan, Petrolle, Leonard, Young Corbett lll, Bud Taylor, J. Fields, Mandell.

I count 12 hall of famers McLarnin beat.

I'm pretty sure he beat a couple of reigning world champions in non-title fights also.

 

Yes, thankyou. Saved me the trouble, off the top of my head I usually struggle to remember who actually made the HOF and who didnt.

Stellar resume...I used to have McLarnin pretty low in comparison because I just didnt know much about him..a little digging and you cant helped but be impressed.

 

I'm a huge Whitaker fan too, but this just goes to show that win's resume is not the only way to judge a fighter. I mean technically carlos ortiz has a better overall resume than whitaker, but from what i have seen on film, whitaker would school him imo. I also dont see Canzoneri beating whitaker either. Relevance to your own era, and head to head ability is a huge factor. I dont want to **** on jimmy mclarnin because he seems like he was a tough dude. However, when most people think of that era, they think of Barney Ross or Joe Louis or Henry Armstrong and Tony Canzoneri. Jimmy Mclarnin is always going to be in thier shadows.

 

Actually Oscar fought alot of men that were half his size from 1993-1997. Just go watch his fights with paez, camacho, hernandez and ruelas and tell me you dont see a size difference. Whitaker was old and he arguably beat de la hoya, chavez was an ancient fossil that was losing to the likes of frankie randall.

In reality, De La Hoya's best wins are quartey, vargas, old whitaker and probably genaro hernandez. If you want to say he beat trinidad, well i can always remind you of the huge gift he got against felix sturm.

 

Broulliard is in the HoF too.

 

H2h is pure speculation and thus irrelevant. You can´t rank on speculation.

McLarnin maybe in their shadows but is still higher than Pac.

 

In your opinion he is, i'm pretty sure when ring magazine make thier updated list, they will rank pac above mclarnin.

 

Probably. But ring magazine´s all-time lists are all pretty bad, so this doesn´t mean much.