Avatars for sues2nd, mike464 and Marnoff; Dorfmeister - who won our bet?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Decebal, Apr 20, 2008.


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  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    We agree, basically, allowing for a really dominating performance over Pavlik who then goes on to do much more - that would have him approaching the 50 you would love to have him in, and I don't think it's impossible (I think Joe would stop Kelly and I think that Kelly is better than you think he is).

    Beats Oscar in a close one on points, stops Hatton in 2, beats Cotto in a dominating performance, retires. Ballpark?
     
    McGrain, Apr 21, 2008
    McGrain, Apr 21, 2008
    #91
  2. Amsterdam

    Amsterdam Boris Christoff Full Member

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    Top 60. The performances against Castillo are as big a negative as you can get because I can't imagine a real top 30 ATG struggling with THAT level of fighter.

    Not any higher, his comp isn't as high as some former era guys like Whitaker, who sometimes get wrongfully ommitted from the top 20, you know?

    Competition should be compared, Cotto is lesser than the comp DLH fought in -

    Whitaker, Quartey, Mosely, Vargas, Trinidad, Forrest....

    Cotto is not on this level, I think we can agree? Big Cotto supporter here also.
     
    Amsterdam, Apr 21, 2008
    Amsterdam, Apr 21, 2008
    #92
  3. mike464

    mike464 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    That's complete crap.
     
    mike464, Apr 21, 2008
    mike464, Apr 21, 2008
    #93
  4. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    This is a mostly good post.

    I will add that Hopkins was absolutley the ideal man to derail Calzaghe at this point in his career. Some people saw it as a soft fight. I saw it as the hardest fight out there for him (most of the anti-Hopkins guys were screaming "Dawson", don't you know). It was a tough, tough fight, and he did beautifully.

    I still felt Joe would win after the KD, but the wheels could have come off there, no question.
     
    McGrain, Apr 21, 2008
    McGrain, Apr 21, 2008
    #94
  5. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    So...the best version of Calzaghe was incapable of fighting at mid-range against Hopkins, incapable of avoiding to dive in with wide flurries that did nothign to Hopkins, incapable of avoiding Hopkins diving in for the clinch?

    Calzaghe had the footwork and stamina to move as much as it took to find the mid-range against Hopkins, the stamina, speed and precise, reasonably hard punch to deliver precise combinations from midrange and the experience to know what Hopkins was trying to do and how to avoid some of those traps!

    That's why his dad was so pissed off with him in the corner. He WASN'T doing it!!!

    Sure, Hopkins was a nightmare for him - we all knew he'd be. We knew Calzaghe would have to work hard and use his head. But he didn't, for most of the fight. He was complacent and lazy.

    If you think that was a good Calzaghe performance and that he couldn't have done better, you are saying Calzaghe has been overrated.

    This is because some of the characteristics Calzaghe is best known/rated for are his adaptability and intelligence, fluid, unorthodox style, stamina and workrate.
     
    Decebal, Apr 21, 2008
    Decebal, Apr 21, 2008
    #95
  6. PrideOfWales

    PrideOfWales Winston Zedmore Full Member

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    I honestly didn't think that Hopkins would be able to perform like he did. He looked pretty sharp and powerful in spurts. I don't know how much of that was down to Calzaghe's naivety but Hopkins impressed me in this fight and it's difficult to see how he could have done very much more apart from taking the fight to Joe a bit more.
     
    PrideOfWales, Apr 21, 2008
    PrideOfWales, Apr 21, 2008
    #96
  7. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    Would have liked to see a LHW version of Ricky Hatton hugging and hitting against Hopkins on Saturday!:lol:
     
    Decebal, Apr 21, 2008
    Decebal, Apr 21, 2008
    #97
  8. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    He could make it. I think Cotto could be really good. Put it this way, if he doesn't fight Mayweather I bet people are handing him the win in around 4 years.

    I bet Mayweather will fight him though..on the comeback trail...get murdered.
     
    McGrain, Apr 21, 2008
    McGrain, Apr 21, 2008
    #98
  9. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    Hopkins performed as well as expected, but he got tired and started to cheat more than I thought he would (get away with). Calzaghe underperformed.
     
    Decebal, Apr 21, 2008
    Decebal, Apr 21, 2008
    #99
  10. Amsterdam

    Amsterdam Boris Christoff Full Member

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    Calm down December, Hatton is underrated remember, Mayweather is god, fights the best.
     
    Amsterdam, Apr 21, 2008
    Amsterdam, Apr 21, 2008
    #100
  11. Decebal

    Decebal Lucian Bute Full Member

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    Of course...the ideal ref for that fight would have been Dave Parris and Bika - the sole judge!:yep
     
    Decebal, Apr 21, 2008
    Decebal, Apr 21, 2008
    #101
  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    No, Hopkins wasn't up to taking it to Joe. He was spending all his energy looking for those countering opportunities, and it all but spent him.

    I don't think Calzaghe was naive particularly, just in a very difficult spot. He had to push the action, he couldn't play the waiting game, the Hopkins game.
     
    McGrain, Apr 21, 2008
    McGrain, Apr 21, 2008
    #102
  13. Amsterdam

    Amsterdam Boris Christoff Full Member

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    You have Cotto over Mayweather?

    Me too, people are starting to realise that a technical pressure fighter is Mayweather's poison slowly but surely, i dont know how those Castillo fights are excused, but they of course just assumed that Castillo was a great fighter also.... WRONG.

    Cotto's quicker, sharper, faster, more relentless and more powerful than Castillo, with a better defence to offset Mayweather's offensive work 'some'.

    I think it'd even be an easy fight for Cotto, possibly ending in a stoppage due to the fact that Floyd is content on fighting cream puffs in comparison and is not prepared for this level of fight.
     
    Amsterdam, Apr 21, 2008
    Amsterdam, Apr 21, 2008
    #103
  14. PrideOfWales

    PrideOfWales Winston Zedmore Full Member

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    This was a good performance in the circumstances. I think given the level of Hopkins performance, Joe has done well. I don't think you've seen Calzaghe struggle before against this kind of style. If you have, you've assumed Calzaghe has somehow magically conquered it somewhere along the line. Bika, Starie, Jimenez, Reid, Thornberry... dig them out if you dare, watch them and tell me that Calzaghe was going to perform any better than he did.
     
    PrideOfWales, Apr 21, 2008
    PrideOfWales, Apr 21, 2008
    #104
  15. Amsterdam

    Amsterdam Boris Christoff Full Member

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    I'd prefer Phil Collins as the ref actually, add to the comedy.:yep
     
    Amsterdam, Apr 21, 2008
    Amsterdam, Apr 21, 2008
    #105
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