Battling Jim Johnson vs Jack Johnson Revisited

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Bronson666, Aug 6, 2025 at 12:03 PM.


  1. apollack

    apollack Boxing Addict Full Member

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    In defense of Joe Botti, I want to say that he spent a tremendous amount of time and effort to research his Joe Jennette book. The book is an excellent resource. Some did not care for his style, but he wrote it in an entertaining, interesting, and unique way, and what he wrote in terms of thoughts/opinions is reasonably based on what he inferred/deduced/surmised based on a copious amount of research. If that isn't your thing, fine. Some eventually came to get it or appreciate it as they read along. When I read A Clockwork Orange, at first I was offput by the incessant unique slang language, but in time came to appreciate it. Furthermore, Botti cited a lot of primary sources, citing them whenever he discussed facts. The book in relevant part is based on facts he obtained from primary sources. He includes a bibliography and footnotes for anyone to cross check if they so desire. We can reasonably disagree on facts, particularly since there are so many sources, and one never knows who is getting their facts right or verified them back then, just like today. But overall the book is well done. Citing two one-star reviews is a bit unfair when the book has an overall 4.3 review rating and was given four 5-star reviews and two 4-star reviews.

    In addition, Joe Botti has also written one of the most entertaining books I have ever read, Thunder & Lightning: The Fighting Gatti Brothers.

    We need to appreciate authors who have spent a tremendous amount of time and effort contributing to boxing history.
     
  2. Boxing GOAT

    Boxing GOAT Active Member Full Member

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    Why would Wills lie about it?
     
  3. guilalah

    guilalah Well-Known Member Full Member

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    https://catalogs.scpauctions.com/on...-boxers-6389404#mz-expanded-view-953836599249

    Question is: was this a title fight? An advertisment says Jack Johnson is champion, Jim Johnson is 'vanquisher of Joe Jeanette'. Does it call Jim Johnson 'challenger'? It's the 'fight of the year' -- but does it say that it is for the heavyweight championship? From Jack Johnson being champion it does not neccessarily follow that any contest he engages in is automatically a championship contest. (compare, La Motta vs. Villemaine, or Duran - de Jesús I ).
     
  4. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    I mentioned those two because anyone expecting a conventional biography would probably be dissapointed by his M O on this book,others gave it positive reviews.
     
  5. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Fighters promote themselves all the time,its part of the business.

    Jeannette said he beat Johnson several times he didn't.
    Langford claimed in one quote he gave Johnson life and death in their fight,he didn't.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2025 at 5:12 PM
  6. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Do you believe Jeannette dropped 20 pounds for his last fight with Johnson? Yes or No? Its a simple question
    Do you believe Langford dropped 9 lbs to fight Johnson ?

    Yes or No?
    I've never questioned the veracity of Johnson's weights for McVey one way or the other.In fact I've never remarked on the difference.

    This is really funny,before you were banned on BS you used to come here and trawl through my posts and repost them there, to try and catch me out, now you're doing it in reverse and pretending someone is supplying you with posts of mine from there! Hilarious! perhaps I should call you." The Post Ghost" LOL
     
  7. Boxing GOAT

    Boxing GOAT Active Member Full Member

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    Sorry that doesn’t cut it for me. Writers, promoters, managers can all be accused of the same thing. Using your logic we should believe no one.
     
  8. HistoryZero26

    HistoryZero26 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    With non HW its different. If a fight does not meet the weight conditions it is not a title fight. HW in theory isn't actually a weight class anyone can be a HW.

    Non title bouts at HW are either A)because the contender clearly hasn't earned it or B)because its speed boxing where the fights not enough rounds or something like that.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2025 at 7:45 PM
  9. Mike Cannon

    Mike Cannon Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Hi Buddy.
    Well you would have been correct before the fighters weighed in on the day before their title fight, but as discussed a couple of days ago, that does not apply these days, both fighters might make 147 for example on the Friday, come fight time on Saturday evening, most way 9/10lbs above 147 and some lots more, so there are no " weight conditions " in the strict sense of the word, how can a fighter claim the title after winning the WW fight, when in fact he weighed the LMW limit ?
    stay safe HZ26, chat soon buddy.
    Mike.
     
    HistoryZero26 likes this.