Berbick vs Chuvalo

Exactly.

Basically. Any other referee would of given him the benefit of the doubt and saw what he was doing.

It was even more apparent he could have continued then the Walcott/Marciano II stoppage.

 

quarry was still on his knee at the count of 10,that means your counted out ,doesn't matter if he could continue or not.zack clayton was right over jerry,he called it correctly

 

He rose and THEN took a knee.

It was a matter of timing and a over zealous referee, not Quarry being unfit to continue or even hurt.

 

In an alphabet soup era, Chuvalo's wins over Quarry, DeJohn, Cleroux and Dante Cane could have all won heavyweight "championships". Well done, you just made Chuvalo a three-time heavyweight champion and consequentally greater than Joe Louis. :happy

Seriously though, aside from an upset win over a coked-up and under-prepared Pinklon Thomas and a John Tate who was on a huge and rapid slide, Berbick wasn't even a legitimate contender during most of his career. To some extent, neither was Chuvalo. The difference was that Chuvalo was a semi-contender in a hugely talented era, while Berbick was a semi-contender during what even I (a Larry Holmes fan) have to admit was an exceptionally poor era.

 

So Quarry mis-timed a count. Sounds like a symptom of being out of it to me. If he wasn't hurt, why did he take a knee? Did he have an itch?

 

Chuvalo.
Hes a much better fighter in my book.

 

We're not going to agree here, but I personally think that Berbick's career was very, very good. The Thomas win was a good legacy victory given that he was a man who people feel was ducked by Holmes, and was generally considered the best heavyweight in the world in early 1986. When did Chuvalo beat a concencus best in the world at any point in his career? Berbick's additonal wins over a prime Greg Page ( another fighter, Holmes was criticized for not facing ), and a peak John Tate, tops his resume off nicely.

While your statement about Chuvalo fighting in a stronger era may be true, I don't necessarily think that we should automatically stamp a fighter as being better than one from a less competitive period, just for being a mere participant. We have to remember that a fighter still has an obligation to make the best of his era, and frankly Chuvalo lost almost everytime he stepped up. He has some decent wins, but he was also beaten by journeyman like Pete Radecmacher and Eduarto Corletti. He defeated a decent fighter in Bob Cleroux, but also lost to him two out of three. Chuvalo was stopped early by novice versions of Frazier and Foreman ( possibly the only two world class punchers his chin was ever tested against. )

 

george chuvalo's chin is an entirely different topic,it ranks up there with the top 3 best heavyweight chins of all time maybe even the best.i suggest you chat to muhammad ali,or even joe frazier and ask them how good george was.you maybe surprised by their answers

 

george chuvalo's chin is an entirely different topic,it ranks up there with the top 3 best heavyweight chins of all time maybe even the best.i suggest you chat to muhammad ali,or even joe frazier and ask them how good george was.you maybe surprised by their answers

 

Precisely why I made a sidenote about it in parenthesis.

I never implied that he had a weak chin. I simply pointed out the fact that his chin's biggest test came against novice versions of Foreman and Frazier, and still he managed to get TKO'd in one way or another. Of course, I don't know if these stoppages were the result of cuts, or whatever, but still..

Why would I want the testimony of the Muhammad Ali who wasn't a particularly big hitter, or even a 16 fight prospect in Joe Frazier who stopped Chuvalo by the way?

 

I would take Chuvalo by close decision

 

because they could lend more meat to this this topic then you can,i was alive when both these fights took place you have very little knowledge of the fights i can tell that
against frazier chuvalo suffered a fractured cheekbone and his eyeball almost dropped out of its socket.against foreman the fight was called off after chuvalo's wife threw her handbag into the ring.

 

Berbick: UD.

 

Exactly why I said and I quote myself " Managed to get TKO'd in one way or another. Of course, I don't know if these stoppages were the result of cuts or whatever, but still."

Well, I certainly hope you can tell that because common sense should tell anyone who read my post that I didn't see those fights, nor were claiming to have seen them in the first place, as I more or less said so...Please read posts and be sure that you understand them before jumping on your high hoarse with **** like " I was there and you have very little knowledge."

My only point, was that two novice fighters whom other men were taking the distance at the time managed to force a technical knockout, particularly Frazier who broke Chuvalo's cheek bone as you said so yourself. These were the only TRUE world class punchers he ever faced, and neither were fully developed yet. The pattern here is clear. While Chuvalo was definately durable, he wasn't unstoppable regardless of the circumstances surrounding those matches....That said, I don't think Berbick would stop him, but I do think that winning a decision is not an unreasonable pick in favor of Trevor Berbick. His wins over Thomas, Tate and Page ( all good boxers in their primes ), not to mention going 15 rounds with a peak Holmes, is comparable or even better than just about anything Chuvalo ever did.. If it makes you happy to think that Chuvalo beating Cleroux one time in three matches, having a controversial win over Quarry, and beating a shot Cleveland Williams was better, then go with it.

Take from it what you will, but please be sure that you understood my perspective before undercutting my credibility on the matter.

 

i never was trying to undercut your credibility,but with out having lived through events you never see the lead up to the fight or the post fight comments either.thats all i'm saying,chuvalo was supposed to fight berbick in halifax nova scotia in 1978 i think at that time he was like 38 or 39 years old over the hill.of coarse berbick would have decisioned him at that point in time,i met both berbick and chuvalo on several occassions berbick was an *******,if you want to know why i say that email me on my im box and i'll tell you a few stories