Bernard Hopkins legacy

I love the cobra!!!

 

1. Greb
2. Monzon
3. Hagler
4. Hopkins
5. Robinson
6. Ketchel
7. Fitzsimmons
8. Cerdan
9. Tiger
10. LaMotta

 

I'm a bigger fan of Hopkins than Jones but it is pretty hard to argue that the Johnson Hopkins fought was as good as the Johnson Jones fought. Not by much though, If you look at what Johnson did in his fight with B-Hop compared to what he does now, the only real difference is he moved more then, taking away a lot of his effective aggression of today. Their performances had a lot to due with Hopkins being at his absolute best when he obliterated Johnson and Jones already having lost enough of his athleticism so that he no longer was as hard to hit or as hard to corner. Johnson was a world class, unbeaten opponent and B-Hop looked like a perfect fighter against him. That's why it is considered one of his best wins, and perhaps his greatest performance.

 

Excellent list. I stray away from rating Fitzsimmons as I do with all fighters before 1900. Their just to hard for me to rate amongst the others. Everything makes sense to me on the list with the exception of Greb at #1 with Monzon at #2. For what they did at 160 I think Monzon's a clear cut above the others, but if anyone should be above him, Greb is a good choice.

 

It is tough to rate guys before the 40's because a lot of time the film is poor if there is any at all. With Greb we have to go by resmue. He beat Walker at middleweight. Conquered Flowers who is top 12 on my list. Beat Tunney at 162 lbs. and has the deepest resmue from 160-175 ever by far. I can't really get into what Greb did right now cause it would take too much time, but he is the only person I could rate higher than Monzon who I have as a clear #2. Hagler and Hopkins can be switched around. In fact a peak Hopkins rates better head 2 head all time than Marv IMO and that is saying something. He would have beaten Hagler over 12 or 15 with both at their peaks.

 

1. Hagler
2. Hopkins
3. Monzon

:good

 

over robinson at middle? likely.

 

I agree that Greb has probably the best resume of any fighter ever, with only Sam Langford and Ezzard Charles close to him. The reason I put Monzon at #1 for middleweight is that most of Greb's great accomplishments, such as the fights with Tunney, Loughran, Rosenbloom, Gibbons, McTigue, and so on all took place above 160, where as everything Monzon did in his extraordinary career happened at 160. Greb is the superior P4P fighter based on resume, but at 160 Monzon really did more than anybody else, although what Greb did acheive at 160 is enough to be top 5 and I really can't argue that much if you put him at #1. I also agree that Hagler and Hopkins are interchangeable, neither one is a clear choice to be above the other, and I do agree that prime for prime Hopkins would most likely win. Hagler was the harder puncher, but apart from that, wherever there is an edge, it would go to Hopkins.

 

I think I've already posted it on this thread, but here is my list of top middleweights:
#1. Carlos Monzon
#2. Marvin Hagler
#3. Bernard Hopkins
#4. Harry Greb
#5. Ray Robinson
#6. Stanley Ketchel
#7. Dick Tiger
#8. Charlie Burley
#9. Jake LaMotta
#10. Emile Griffith

Very tough division to rank (I believe my previous list was a little different), The only thing that isn't really hard for me to decide is who should be #1. I would probably rank Hopkins over Hagler by a spot or two on an all-time P4P list, but at middleweight, I'll go with Hagler to be above B-Hop. Robinson & Greb are without question the greatest fighters here when taking in their whole careers, but at 160 they just round out the top 5. Again, no fighters before 1900, so no Fitzsimmons, no Nonperiel Dempsey, and no Tommy Ryan. Cerdan is right off the top 10, because even if he could have beaten LaMotta in their rematch, it tragically never happened, and broken shoulder or not, LaMotta won.

 

Nice post:deal and I'm not a big Hopkins fan

 

The problem with Fans like you...is that you have very little hostorical knowledge of a fighter. this deems you purely iignorant...but its not your fault.

This is how I see Hopkins career.

People forget Major things.

The big fights only came for B-Hop post trinidad, after the age of 36.


He didn;t have a Frank Warren manouvering through pointless defenses. He did it his way.

He beat all the top guys at Middle.

Glenn Johnson
Keith Holmes (beat Richie Woodhall when he had a pulse unlike Calzgahe who dragged him out of retirement).
Joppy
Triniday
etc....

He then moved to Lght heavy to defeat the no:1 Tarver...in a shut out.

I only saw Roy Jones or Maybe a James toney as fighters who could have beat a prime B-Hop during that time.

Forget Calzaghes win....it was seen that the 1st time Joe fought an Elite fighter (all be it a past his best one), he looked unconvincing. The 1st 6 rounds showed you what a BHop would have done more consistantly in is pomp.

 

OK, the majority of his career was at middleweight and he should be remembered as 1 of the top 5 ever without a doubt, but I think Hopkins's legacy should be defined by what he did after leaving the division. Coming off two defeats and at over 40 years of age, to jump 2 weight categories and fight the undisputed light-heavyweight champion of the world, and give an absolutely virtuoso performance, a brilliant dominating win, was just stunning. He then defeated the best defence in boxing who hadn't lost in about 8 years in Winky Wright, then schooled the apparent #2 P4P fighter in the world Joe Calzaghe with a supreme display of defensive boxing that was ludicrously underappreciated by the judges. A ****ing legend.

 

well hes got a better resume then calzaghe thats for sure

 

So has my auntie Pam.