Bernard Hopkins vs Marvin Hagler.

Bollox.

 

Jones top5 wins are better than Hopkins, Hopkins has more depth/longevity. Jones peak ability was a couple of level above Hopkins though.

 

Thanks for sharing that different way of looking at it, makes sense... I would still favor Hagler head to head with Hop (my opinion) But, I also get that what BHop brings to the table is a tough nut to crack as well ... The Jones/BHop comparison makes a lot of sense as well. While we might rate BHop over RJJ in terms of ATG status. I pick prime RJJ over BHop each and every time head to head. His speed and being able to pick hopkins apart would always be too much for Hopkins ...You could make the case that prime RJJ, would be too much for everyone at 160. But, that`s a whole other post !

 

PowerPuncher, you still see Jones over Hopkins, prime for prime as well ? I still see it that way. the thing with Hopkins is, that he has been still taking names over all these years. So he really makes a case for himself climbing the ATG ladder just because he`s still here and he`s still doing it. It is an amazing run, without a doubt !

 

Marvin wouldn't go after him he would go in and out and pressure Hopkins but not allow Bernard to set the pace...people forget Marvin had fast hands and good boxing ability and good legs...he did know how to destroy but usually with a boxing attack (the Hearns FIGHTS WAS unique )...Marvin wouldn't fall into B-Hops trap and B-hop would not flash and flurry and steal like Leonard

 

Don't tell me you two believe the ray Leonard hype. What a cherry picker. Benitez was totally washed up. I'm pretty sure he never won a fight again. And Hearns and Duran: overtrained and undertrained. I know for a fact that Ray snuck into Durans camp before new orleans disguised with a handle bar mustache as a tortilla vendor, feeding Duran gorditas day after day. The day before no mas he gave him a high powered laxative. Hearns was forced to come in that light; you think he wanted to? Anyway the stoppage was bs just like against Benitez. Don't get me started on the Hagler fight. Giant ring, making Hagler come out orthodox, making Hagler burn himself out while Ray remained fresh not fighting, and then when Hagler was thought to be done coming out of retirement and stealing rounds with nothing punches. Had Ray not asked, at the end of the 12th that the fight be rescheduled who do you think wins?

Yeah Ray earned it.

 

I can't take your arguement serious with this at all. It isn't close.

 

You obviously meant to say that Duran went into the Hagler fight with counter-punching, conservative strategy, which Hagler did fall into.

 

Yep. That would be the best fight plan.

 

it is...but jones was still FAR better a fighter than hopkins in his prime, beat him h2h and owned (for a time) 3 seperate divisions with a title at heavyweight being icing on the cake.

hopkins has a case for being ahead, but so does jones

 

I think that Hopkins rates higher than Jones as an ATG.

 

Jones or Hopkins comes down to if you prefer raw talent, or gritted accomplishment.

 

well put :happy for me, raw talent is FAR in jones favour and hopkins only has a slight edge in accomplishment

 

Whether it is down mostly to raw talent or learned skill really shouldn't matter. If one guy's better, then he's better, and that's that. Roy was better than Hopkins, definitely. Roys resume is certainly on the same level. Roy was even more dominant than Hopkins during his prime run. All B-Hop really has over him is longevity, and freaky as it may be, I don't think that's enough to overcome everything else (and you should all know how badly I wish that it was enough).