Bernard Hopkins vs Marvin Hagler.

Hopkins isn't in Prime Jones class, that's not a knock on Hopkins, it's just Jones was so super human. Hopkins is an ATG and arguably even top10, Jones dominated him with 1 hand and Hopkins never really fancied the fight again.

Jones has the most underrated competition of all time, he beat something like 20 world champions and beat more Ring ranked opponents than anyone during the time (something like 30).

Some of those guys Jones was knocking out in 1 or 2 rounds were going 12 rounds with Toney, Benn, Julian Jackson

Eastman wouldn't make a top20 in Jones wins.

Jones Competition > Hopkins Competition in the period BY FAR. Jones has the better top5 and better top 10 wins.

 

agreed. roy's resume is tough to gauge but i feel it's the case it's undervalued by the ease with which he dominated

1)hopkins-easy UD, went on to be hall of famer

2)James Toney-top 168 fighter, p4p number 1, destroyed from bell to bell (**** the weight loss, his own fault)

3)Antonio Tarver-clear but close UD, very good light heavyweight

4)John Ruiz-WAY underrated now. Ruiz would have made a much uglier fight with lewis, non controversial win over holyfield, beat many of the top names in his era....NO ONE but Tua had such an easy night with Ruiz. This marks a difference from hopkins for me. Jones had no business dominating but he did

5)Reggie Johnson-very good light heavy, COMPLETELY dominated and subsequently written off

6)Griffin-Eddie Futch trained Light heavy, very very good in his prime. One of the best first round KOs in history

7)Virgil Hill-One of the top light heavies of his era, past prime for sure, one of the best body shots ever thrown

this is just the top wins but there are plenty of contenders (and not cops or mail men) out there as well. the more I read jones' resume and watch how PAINFULLY dominant he was, the closer he gets to hopkins in that regard. it was said (SJS i think...) that Jones dominated lesser competition than hopkins

if that's true, it ain't by much. and in his prime, he was pretty much untouchble. i'd rather dominate a reggie johnson with some knockdowns thrown in than have an ugly mess with howard eastman any day of the week

 

Good points. prime Jones dominated ! It`s easy to look at post Ruiz RJJ and find issues. I actually feel that going up to heavy and then trying to drop down and still compete at 175 was too much to ask at given his age and # of fights. Dropping down, Roy lost that special something. He wasn`t an `untouchable` anymore. But prime RJJ was incredible !!

 

I don`t how this thread took off in this direction, but ... Honestly, could we see anyone beating absolute prime 160-165 Roy Jones ? I like him over Hagler, Monzon and I think SRR would have had problems with him as well. It wasn`t just RJJ`s superhuman speed, he could crack at that weight. He could hurt you with one shot, and blister you with blinding speed and get you out. That Jones fought with a nasty mental edge, Take a close look at what a fired up RJJ looks like in his return with Griffin...

 

Jones.................................Hopkins

Toney.................................?
Hopkins...............................Calzaghe (arguably)
Tarver.................................Tarver
Griffin..................................Wright
Ruiz.....................................Trinidad
Hill.......................................Taylor (arguably)
Johnson...............................DLH
McCallum.............................Pavlik
Woods.................................Echols
Gonzalez.............................Pascal
Harding................................Allen
Lucas...................................Holmes
Del Valle...............................Eastman
Sosa....................................Mercado
Malinga................................Vanderpool
Grant...................................Johnson

Where's Hopkins' superior resume again?

He'd need to beat more Clouds than there are in the sky on an autumn day to surpass Jones.

 

I know about the champions, 18, but are you sure about vs top 10 opposition. Because 30 guys beat is rarefied air indeed.

 

In general he doesn't have the basic fundamentals that Hopkins does.

 

At cutting the ring off? Absolutely.The Hearns fight, in many regards, was an absolute fluke.Hearns fought a ridiculously stupid fight and really made Hagler look a hell of a lot more convincing as a pressure fighter than he actually was.




I'm a huge Mah-vin Hagler fan, butt fakts are faxts.

 

I wouldn't give him resume, which is a point that others have backed up since.

I think he absolutely needs the clear edge in resume to outrank Roy, and I don't think he has it. I'd say that they are close enough though, and that Hopkins is still good enough, that he could possibly end up with that clear edge. What would, say, a win over Froch at this stage do?

 

You are hilarious !! Fluke ?? Do you have any idea how long Marvin and Goody worked on that using tall mbil sparring partners ?? And you call THAT a fluke ?? You may be a Hagler fan, but you are totally clueless when it comes to analyzing the Hearns fight. Hearns fought that way because Hagler MADE him,exactly the way he prepared to fight him. Hgaler swarmed and didn`t even use his jab, all power shots. Ben Tackie, that is THE most brilliant comment I have read on here in a long time ...

 

Hagler worked on pressuring so that he could draw Hearns into a fight. It was his best chance of winning as trying to outbox Hearns wasn't going to happen. Thats more of a plus on Hearns' boxing ability rather than a minus on Hagler's, who was an excellent boxer himself at range.

It wasn't a sure thing that Hagler would win a war with Hearns considering the power Hearns possessed. However, Hagler's chin and general durability outdid that of Hearns.

It would perhaps have been classed as a fluke if Hearns totally outboxed and out punched Hagler without taking many punches in return during the 3 rounds, until Hagler KO'd him with a lucky barrage. That never happened.

It was a generally a 50/50 war with Hagler taking over down the stretch of the 3 rounds and proving too much in the end.

 

Hopkins is at his best versus low output guys with low ring IQ. This is antithesis of Hagler. Hagler by UD.

 

Maybe but froch is another limited time for brawler. it is the same argument that flea has used against mayweather. if Hopkins were to beat Dawson then I would be impressed. then he would be overcoming a clear stylistic and athletic disadvantage