Bernard Hopkins vs. Sugar Ray Robinson, at 160

I'll take Ray by decision, or maybe, just maybe, late round TKO.

 

NO CONTEST, Ray Robinson by a one-sided wide margin and more probably by KO!

 

At their absolute 160 best i'd take SRR by decision i think. There just isn't that many middleweights with genuine class and slashing speed but he sure fits the bill. He's got genuine power on top of that and excellent durability. He had a couple of losses there but on his best night i favour him. I think his sheer speed matches him up well against all of the big 3, Hagler, Monzon and Hopkins.

 

Robinson was inconsistent when he came back from his 3 year absence in 1955, and he was not anywhere near the fighter he had been in 51 when he came back to my mind.

The only person that beat a prime middleweight robinson was turpin when robbi was on a european tour messing about and not taking turpin seriously.

i think this would be a great fight,hopkins is a fighter that i see given robinson trouble, a clever defensive counter puncher that can then turn on the offense and is great on the inside will test sugar or anyone for that matter at middleweight.

I would go for robinson by UD or SD. I see his handspeed and footwork causing hopkins problems and his more flashy combos winning him a very close fight

 

Hm, interesting fight. I think if Hopkins fights a bit similar to the Trinidad fight he could take it. Box from the distance, use his feet, lateral movement and jab, when it comes to the midrange, go even closer, clinch him, be rough, use feints to set him up and force the ref to break it. Sounds easier than it is and Robinson would win rounds regardless but I can see Hopkins winning.
Robinson would be the favourite though.

 

Robinson: UD. By a fair margin too.

 

If there is one aspect of Hopkins' game that is being understated here it is his efficiency.

Back when B-hop had a full tank he was not one to allow his man to get one over him; he would pester, hunt and confuse with fluidity. If Robinson lands his hooks, Hopkins will bore into him, rabbit punch, use the head, land the counter cross and make things happen.

Hopkins is the stronger man which counts for a lot when you consider how adept he is at controlling ring centre; this is the kinda fight were Robinson needs to be the cute 'pot-shotter', but he is an aggressively styled fighter who will meet a defensive wiz.

Robinson involved himself in so many aspects of a fight that Hopkins may reply on numerous levels. As limited as Jermain Taylor was comparatively it was his conserved nature that diffused much of what Hopkins usually has to offer.

It's a great fight with Robinson’s flash n' crash, blood n' guts, but Hopkins, (the best Hopkins) would likely take the reins and sculpt his decision through the rounds.

 

I commented on this bout not too long ago im sure of it, it was a long post, but i ultimately took Robinson.

 

Personally I don't mind Hopkins receiving his just due among the great middleweights as a superb defensive technician and strategist...and while Robinson did prefer to attack as you stated, he could also use mobility to time and capitalize against oncoming foes.
So if the fight would progress as mentioned above, and Hopkins would bore into him and attempt to smother and rabbit punch...You don't think Robinson has the ability to move and offset Hopkins' favorite tactic throwing a combination leaning in with the head or shoulder? I remember Hakkor giving Hopkins awkward moments by avoiding his lunges with just mobilty alone...strictly in survival mode.
Robinson would be moving and countering with a variety of hard counters...and while Hopkins could technically 'take away' Trinidad's left or Pavlik's right by using his footwork...Robinson would be the most complete offsensive package Hopkins ever would have encountered.
I can see your above scenarios to a certain extent...but not to the point of a Hopkins' victory.
Another point to be made is that Robinson when the tide of the battle wasn't going in his favor...he would aggressively fight that tide or pattern and change the coarse of the fight. Can the same be said of Hopkins?

 

You're summations are always a joy to read whether one agree's or not. I'm going SRR in this one but your post certainly has me thinking.

 

Hopkins would be very tough for Robinson ... He is bigger, stronger and would have the advantage of punching down. His speed and defense would pose problems. In addition, Ray was not a natural middleweight ... still he was Ray Robinson with exceptional speed and power ... a terrific match up ...

 

When a fighter is in survival mode then he will prove hard to pin down as Malignaggi did for Hatton until he was pulled out.

Negativity in the ring is as effective a deodorant as a defensive master's pivots and rolls; if they don't want to fight, then trying to engage them is like attempting to open a can without the tin opener.

Because Robinson is so active a fighter; both in terms of output and variety of attack that Hopkins, a fighter who leaches off what the opponent presents, has much too manipulate.

Hopkins biggest problem has been getting his tactics wrong in big fights, but then again you could say he has been somewhat unlucky on the scorecards in the last few years. The first Taylor fight may have been the example of 'changing the course of the fight' you were looking for.

Robinson was many things, but one thing he was not was hard to figure out. He was just very hard to beat, but that's were things become a little more even because Hopkins is without peer at debilitating the opponents performance.

Further more, Robinson is thought to be the P4P king, so sometimes a match-up can deal out that mythological card for good measure. 'We know Hopkins could beat Robinson, but we don't want to cross that line mentality’. Not suggesting you, but potentially in the thread.

Robinson was fantastic, but he could be beat, and Hopkins, at his sapping best, is a tall order for an excitable 'Sugar' Ray.

 

When asked about this match-up, Hopkins himself, states that as a welterweight, SRR was the nonpareil...but as a middleweight he could be beaten. Hopkins found solice in the fact he was the larger man and stronger man in this match-up with Sugar. He went on to say that he would pressure Robinson to gain the win...he did say that he would have to pay a price with that plan.

I like Hopkins. He is the finest fundamentally sound defensive middleweight I've seen on film...Period. It would not take a huge leap of faith to say he could beat anyone who campaigned at 160 lbs on a given night considering the talent and craft he brings to the ring. Hagler, Monzon, Greb,...and SRR. All could possibly lose at one time or another to the best Bernard Hopkins...That being said, the reverse holds true as well in my opinion.

Fighting in an offensive mode, as Robinson did, opportunities would present themselves to another great fighter to take advantage of...BUT the key here is what you have mentioned, "variety" of attack. Without given and set patterns how does Hopkins react to an attack that has no set repetition which he so readily exploits as he did with Trinidad. it is much harder to manipulate something if you don't know what will come next. Robinson was too experienced to fall into repetitive patterns in the ring. Hopkins respected Trinidad's power and capabilities...and while it can be debated, Robinson carries similar power, and much better delivery, and timing with offensive and counter punching during the fight.

True. Hopkins definitely won the first Taylor fight. It should be considered a robbery...I do agree that Hopkins tactics did 'change the coarse of the fight'. But consider for a moment, that while Taylor is a very talented athlete, he should not be mistaken for an experienced, all time great prizefighter. Taylor is a relative neophypte compared to Robinson...(he was practically hyperventilating at times) Hopkins was able to carry Taylor along, make him fight at a quicker pace than he was comfortable with, Taylor was exhausted near the end of the fight, to his credit he stayed on his feet...and it was a valueable learning experience.

The logic in your first sentence is contradictory...If Robinson's style was repetitive and easily figured out, he would not have had the success he enjoyed from the ring.
If I may ask, with all due respect...why is Robinson not hard to figure out? When I look at film, I see a varied attack, speed, precision, and devastating power. Robinson carries the firepower to hurt people. There is no set pattern to the way Robinson fights, he has the ability and timing to lead with any punch. Equally dangerous with both hands, can you name a punch Robinson does not have in his arsenal? This is not a Trinidad, Glencoffe Johnson, or Pavlik... Hopkins so readily shut down. I am genuinely puzzed to this response.

If Hopkins stays back, Robinson will have the opportunity to beat him to the punch. Robinson will realize that he is the fighter with faster hands and feet...and better power. If Hopkins pressures, like he stated he would have done against Ray, he finds an opponent who has the speed and timing to attempt to fire hard combinations off...between Hopkins' own blows. Roy Jones made this observation from an interview in Penthouse or Playboy magazine. Hopkins will find that he is not the only one thinking and making adjustments tactically in the ring.