Bert Gilroy , was he jobbed and if so , when and by whom ?

I'll get back to you , please bear with me.:good

 

Bert did have a few legitimate losses, certainly at the beginning of his career starting out as a 15 year old Pro, and then a few towards the end of his career mostly against the Big Boys (HWs), there were about 4 losses for the reasons you mentioned!

here's one of the best examples of that

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very real possibility, he is Britain's best middleweight!

this thread and an honest search through the facts & reports available by Googling him, to say nothing of his actual Scrapbook (which is available), and the obvious Shots and realities given to those involved with him, Roderick, Sadd, McAvoy, Mills, Woodcock and later the Turpin boys...

none of them were held back or delayed when they came into position, yet Bert was for the full 10 years he was the No.1 contender (???).

 

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Why-and I'm not been smart-was he not given a shot?

 

"the Greatest Prize in Sport." thats why!

Boxing as you know is very Partisan, and there is no place where that is not only more obvious, but desperately desired than England - the Home of the Noble Art, the Sweet Science, Boxing.

for all of it's history & pride, England/Britain could not produce a World Champion among the Bigmen, the Heavyweights and the heavier divisions.

1939, for the first time in years England had 3 possible fighters, McAvoy and Harvey are still possible candidates, but the NEW focus is on Freddie Mills, and shortly after Bruce Woodcock (1942) would share that hope!

As early as 1940 he, Mills, is being sold to America as a potential world champion and eventual challenger to Joe Louis for the Heavyweight crown, Ring Magazine 1940.

By 1944 he Mills (Ted Broadribb & Jack Solomons), challenges Louis, so if Freddie fails we can still put Woodcock forward. From 1942 it became the Mills & Woodcock road show. Britain only had 2 fighters didn't you know!

Gilroy broke his pelvis in 1940, 3 weeks before his match with McAvoy, and though promised the fight upon his return it never happed. McAvoy held that title 'uncontested' for 5 more years, and twice in those years though No.1, Gilroy is dropped from the position of challenger? In the meatime the war is heating up and Mills is sold more & more to the States, monthly and weekly at home.

Sadd, & Roderick are moved into title elimination, Roderick wins and sits in the position of title challenger for 3 more years, 3 years(?) As stated Mills is moving along, has a L-HW title eliminator with McAvoy and 4 months later, 4 MONTHS, is fighting Harvey (in his last ever fight) for the TITLE. Again Gilroy still No.1 has been waiting 2 years at this point. It carries on for and additional 6 years and two weight divisions from here on.

Roderick, McAvoy, Mills and Woodcock are all moved into place and Gilroy lingers in the background as a 10year (all in), 1939 - 48, No.1 contender. He technically sat longer than some of them were champion, and they just kept refusing him the fight or again as stated outright dropped him as official challenger (1942 & 44 MW) and in Mills L-HW case 1945 -48.

they didn't just do it, they knew with the World at War nobody would even think about who their champions & contenders were, people were more interested in living, surviving the war years and praying for it to end. A perfect smoke screen for Boxings "finer practices" to flourish!

see link -

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_K8ZwK4v24Q[/ame]


go to about 14:55 to about 15:30, the former contender states clear Bert Gilroy was ALWAYS No.1, and they KEPT him there!!!

it was done in the hope ENGLAND might for the first time in history capture "the Greatest Prize in Sport" - the Heavyweight Championship of the World or titles in the heavier weights!

and the Scots/ITALIAN ******* (that's how they were thought of in Britain at the time), was just in the way, the only threat in British boxing to Freddie Mills!!!

and they got away with it. ahh but it's a lovely old game, this boxing BIZ!!!

 

Thank you!

 

Just looking at Mills record and he fought Gilroy in 1944 and stopped him in 8 rounds. Was it a close fight?

 

"Britains greatest MW"???

I think Mcvey hit the nail on the head speaking of partisanship.

Gilroy lost nearly 30 percent of his fights, 11 by KO and somehow that gets translated to Gilroy having lost a few fights on the up and up. I understand a family member trying to gain a little recognition for their ancestor but lets not get carried away. The guy lost to EVERY good fighter he faced and yet better fighters than the ones he lost to were ducking him? He had a shot at McAvoy and was injured. Did McAvoy break Gilroy's Pelvis? He fought Freddie Mills in 1944 when both were in their primes (not four years later when Mills won the championship and was already fading) and was stopped in 8 rounds.

You harp on the idea that Gilroy was a number one contender for nearly a decade without getting a shot, I think an equally perplexing question is what the heck was this guy doing for all of that time to be considered a #1 contender even for a devalued domestic title?? He went unbeaten for 5 1/2 years from 37 to 43 but look at his competition.

Factor in the fact that a war was in the offing, something you dismiss, yet which froze the boxing situation pretty much world wide during Gilroy's career and its not a stretch to make the connection that you might be overrating your grandpap a bit.

Your conspiracy isnt even very well formulated. From what I can gather you insinuate that with the war coming nobody would pay any attention to the British title or British fighters so the powers that be, which were looking for the best peacock to display to the world (which wasnt paying attention) could essentially do whatever they want. So, while looking for the prize peacock they decide to freeze out a guy who according to you may not only have been the greatest British middleweight of that time, but EVER, because... I dont know, either he was a Scots/Italian, or because for some reason the British powers felt that guys like Len Harvey, Bruce Woodcock, Freddy Mills, Jock McAvoy were better...

Really? Thats the best you can come up with?

"and the Scots/ITALIAN ******* (that's how they were thought of in Britain at the time), was just in the way, the only threat in British boxing to Freddie Mills!!!"

Ahem, need I remind you once again:

1944-02-16 Freddie Mills United Kingdom

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the fight report is up above you, post #17...
with the headline "Mills recieves a lesson in Boxing & Footwork", Gilroy was ahead on pts before the "cut stoppage."

 

WOW Lord Tywin, quite an anger felt English partisan response...

another, conveniently overlooking FACTS and TIMELINES and most of all - the other said fighters... were they at all interupted? NO!

But rather given their shots right away, and in the case of Roderick, given his chance and secured for 3 further years.

Do you think reasonably itelligent people would just offer a case without the evidence, read the man's biography and even better get a copy of his Scrapbook...

Gilroy brings into question damn near every English Bigman's claim, from the greatest period of all, and you are obviously of the character that hates this fact and will try desperately to marginalize it while ignoring every Report, Rating, Dates, and Commentries from the period, repoters and fellow fighters!

of course the humble & insightful approach (existing damn near everywhere else but Britain), would be to be pleased, proud and grateful, that we, Britain can add another Great to our credentials. Not the English way.

P.S Bert Gilroy NEVER had a bad word against his fellow fighters, he knew as everybody else did, the scoundrels were the ones who ran the sport.

 

Right :good I was struggling to read that and skipped over it.

 

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Nice Commentary Report here for anyone interested, last paragraph states a lot...