Best Book on Stanley Ketchel?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Seamus, Mar 15, 2017.


  1. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    There are 20 something editors at Box Rec. He who edits last wins. Do you self a favor, look up Saintly Ketches's height. you'll see plenty of 5'7" out there.

    Check wikipedia.

    Stanisław Kiecal, better known in the boxing world as Stanley Ketchel, was a Polish American professional boxer who became one of the greatest World Middleweight Champions in history. He was nicknamed "The Michigan Assassin." [url]Wikipedia[/url]

    [url]Born[/url]: September 14, 1886, [url]Grand Rapids, MI[/url]
    [url]Died[/url]: October 15, 1910, [url]Springfield, MO[/url]
    This content is protected

    [url]Nationality[/url]: American
    [url]Place of burial[/url]: [url]Holy Cross Cemetery, Colma, CA[/url]

    When Johnson and Ketchel were doing a photo ops for the fight, the promoter had Ketchel wear high heeled cowboy boots to make him look taller. If Johnson was 6' and a shade, Ketchel in these high heel booths looks about 5'9" tall. But without the high heels, he's obviously shorter! In the fight films it looks like Johnson has more than 3 " of height on Ketchel.

    Now, can you show me one great middle with a 70" reach or less?! I'll ask again.
     
  2. FrankinDallas

    FrankinDallas FRANKINAUSTIN

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    Based on this thread I re-watched the Papke fight over at YouTube. Besides Papke's very sexy
    underwear, I'm sorry to say that Ketchel looked ultra crude and sloppy. The bout was a wrestling match,
    they both grabbed more than Andre Ward or Wlad Klit. Then re-watched Ketchel-Johnson. You have to
    honor Ketchel's cojone's (or wonder how crazy he was!) to step in there with Johnson, but again he comes
    across as merely crude and unskilled save for good work to the body vs Papke.

    The guy would be a UFC fighter today; too slow, wild and crude for modern boxers. Surely not a top 10
    ATG MW?
     
  3. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    If I remember rightly, the Ketchel-Papke fight on film was considered a very poor effort and dull performance by reporters at the time. So it's perhaps unfortunately that we have that as the main film to view Ketchel.
     
  4. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    Check your internet wankery with actual contemporary measurements...

    Tale of the Tape for the Langford Match
    Sept 11 1909, Indiana Freeman

    "Stanley Ketchel: How the Battler Sizes Up
    Height: 5 ft 11inches
    Reach: 73.5 inches"

    Tale of the Tape for the Johson Match
    Oct 10, 1910, Duluth News-Tribune
    "The measurements of the men are as follows. Ketchell- height, 5 feet 10 3/4 inches, reach 72 2/3 inches"

    Commenting on a proposed Johnson bout
    Idaho Statesman, April 25. 1909
    "Ketchel
    Height... 5 ft. 10 3-4
    Reach... 72 1-2 in."
     
  5. Perry

    Perry Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I've read extensively concerning that fight. It was considered a stinker performance.
     
  6. FrankinDallas

    FrankinDallas FRANKINAUSTIN

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    Seamus....with all due respect....looking at old photos of Ketchel and Johnson both in the ring and out clearly show Johnson to be 4-6 inches taller than Ketchel, and I don't think (but correct me if I'm wrong) Johnson was 6'3' or more.
    I'd embed the photos but I don't know how to insert jpegs here.

    It was all "Fake News" in early 1900 newspapers, especially about boxing. Boring one sided bouts become battles between titans.
     
  7. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    Photos can be very deceiving. These measurements are independent and the first three I found doing a simple search. Did I think the topic warranted more attention I would go further.... perhaps if I'm bored I will regardless.

    But if it is all fake news, does that make Johnson, in reality, 5 foot 10 instead of 6 foot and change?
     
  8. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Packey McFarland was 5' 7" and when he was photographed with Ketchel Ketchel is taller by at least an inch or two. Tommy Burns was 5' 7" and when he and Ketchel were photographed together Ketchel was at least an inch or two taller. The best would be an early tale of the tape, from around the Joe Thomas fights, but Im too lazy to look. I have his death certificate but it doesnt list his height.
     
  9. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    [url]http://cdn.fansided.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/122/files/2011/12/KetchelPapkeTaleoftheTape.jpg[/url]
     
  10. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    This content is protected
     
  11. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    You were the one who told me Wikipaedia was "unreliable"!
    This is their take on the Johnson v Ketchel fight is this true too? Because you cant just cherry pick what suits you ,you b*goted buffoon!lol

    "The match with Ketchel was originally thought to have been an exhibition, and in fact it was fought by both men that way, until the 12th round, when Ketchel threw a right to Johnson's head, knocking him down. Quickly regaining his feet, and very annoyed, Johnson immediately dashed straight at Ketchell and threw a single punch, an uppercut, a punch for which he was famous, to Ketchel's jaw, knocking him out. The punch knocked out Ketchell's front teeth; Johnson can be seen on videotape removing them from his glove, where they had been embedded."

    CyberZone.
    Stanley Ketchel
    (Stanislaus Kiecal)
    (the "Michigan Assassin")

    BORN September 14 1886; Grand Rapids, Michigan (Some sources report 1887)
    DIED
    October 15 1910; Conway, Missouri (shot and killed)
    HEIGHT
    5-9
    WEIGHT
    142-170 1/4 lbs
    RACE
    White; Polish-American
    MANAGERS
    Joe O'Connor (1904-1909), Willus Britt (1909-1910)



    Where is your source for Ketchel's reach by the way?
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2017
  12. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    To answer the underlined
    Three consensus great middleweights with a reach of less than 70 inches!
    Name: Tony Zale
    Alias: Man of Steel
    Birth Name: Anthony Florian Zaleski
    Born: 1913-05-29
    Birthplace: Gary, Indiana, USA
    Died: 1997-03-20 (Age:83)
    Hometown: Chicago, Illinois, USA
    Stance: Orthodox
    Height: 5′ 7½″ / 171cm
    Reach: 69″ / 175cm
    Boxing Record: [url]click[/url]



    Name: Mickey Walker
    Alias: Toy Bulldog
    Birth Name: Edward Patrick Walker
    Born: 1901-07-13
    Birthplace: Elizabeth, New Jersey, USA
    Died: 1981-04-28 (Age:79)
    Hometown: Elizabeth, New Jersey, USA
    Stance: Orthodox
    Height: 5′ 7″ / 170cm
    Reach: 67″ / 170cm
    Boxing Record: [url]click[/url]


    Name: Jake LaMotta
    Alias: Bronx Bull
    Birth Name: Giacobbe LaMotta
    Born: 1922-07-10
    Birthplace: Bronx, New York, USA
    Hometown: Bronx, New York, USA
    Stance: Orthodox
    Height: 5′ 8″ / 173cm
    Reach: 67″ / 170cm
    Boxing Record: [url]click[/url]

    Thanks once again for the opportunity to show what an absolute d*ck head you are!:aaaaa:
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2017
  13. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Thanks for proving my point. Bravo! You got JUST Three examples. My point that Ketchel is short with a very short reach stands!
     
  14. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    You have to love these tale of the tape exaggerations. Again, look at the Johnson vs Ketchel photo when Ketchel was in boots, or the actual fight film. Johnson has more than 3" on him easily.
     
  15. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    I have listed four contemporary sources stating his height between 5-9 /12 and 5-11 with a reach of 72" or greater. You have come up with boxrec or wikipedia or somesuch other internet gibberish. Who wins this one?

    None of the sources list his reach at less than 72". Where do you get sub-72 from?

    And if Ketchel's height was inflated, we must assume also that Johnson's height of 6 feet was inflated and that he was actually 5-10?

    You are demonstrating both willful ignorance and intellectual inconsistency in your stance. Bravo. Two birds with one stone is quite an achievement.