Best five wins from the best contenders

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Gazelle Punch, Jul 29, 2020.


  1. Gazelle Punch

    Gazelle Punch Well-Known Member Full Member

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    This is an absolute rip off of Mendozas best five wins for lineal heavy weight champions. Here we will be starting off with some of the best 40 contenders in the HW division and adding from there. The 40+ individuals are in no particular order and when they’re finished add on any reasonable fighter we may have missed within reason. Voting will be the same as in the previous post except voting will only last 48 hours.
    A first place vote = 5 points
    A second place vote = 4 points
    A thrid place vote = 3 points
    A fourth place vote = 2 points
    A fifth-place vote = 1 point

    Archie Moore Top five
    1)Harold Johnson (19)
    2) Nino Valdez (18)
    3) Jimmy Bivins (17)
    4) Bob Baker (13)
    5) Bob Satterfield (4)

    Chris Byrd
    1) Vitali Klitschko
    2) David Tua
    3) Evander Holyfield
    4) Jameel Mcline
    5) Fres Oquendo

    Sam Langford

    1) Harry Wills
    2) Joe Jeanette
    3) Sam Mcvea
    4) Gun Boat Smith
    5) George Godfrey

    Vitali Klitschko
    1) Corrie Sanders
    2) Sam Peters
    3) Herbie Hide
    4) Juan Carlos Gomez
    5) Tomas Adamak

    Joe Jeannette
    1) Sam Langford
    2) Sam Mcvea
    3) Jack Johnson
    4) Jeff Clarke
    5) George Carpentier

    Harry Wills

    1) Sam Langford
    2) Sam Mcvea
    3) Luis Angel Firpo
    4) Fred Fulton
    5) Joe Jeannette

    Jerry Quarry
    1) Floyd Patterson
    2) Ron Lyle
    3) Earnie Shavers
    4) Mac Foster
    3) Thad Spencer

    Jimmy Bivins
    1) Bob Pastor
    2) Ezzard Charles
    3) Lee Q Murray
    4) Three way tie Archie Moore
    5) Joey Maxim/ Lee Savold

    Ken Norton

    1) Muhammad Ali
    2) Jimmy Young
    3) Jerry Quarry
    4) Three way tie Ron Stander
    5) Larry Middleton/ Henry Clark

    Oscar Bonavena (voting now)
    Harold Johnson (Voting now)
    Bob Pastor
    David Tua
    Zoe Folley
    Eddie Machen
    Ron Lyle
    Cleveland Williams
    Nino Valdez
    Frank Bruno
    Sam Mcvea
    Donovan Ruddock
    Tommy Morrison
    Corrie Sanders
    Ernie Terrell
    Bob Baker
    Jimmy Ellis
    Buster Mathis
    Lou Nova
    Elmer Ray
    Jimmy Young
    Michael Dokes
    Roland Lastarza
    Ike Ibeabuchi
    George Godfrey
    Billy Conn
    Earnie Shavers
    Gerry Cooney
    Rex Layne
    Alexander Povetkin
    Deontay Wilder
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2020 at 5:07 AM
  2. Gazelle Punch

    Gazelle Punch Well-Known Member Full Member

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    We will kick it off with the old mongoose Archie Moore. These are the best five wins not necessarily the best HW wins.
    1) Nino Valdez
    2)Harold Johnson
    3) Jimmy Bivins
    4) Bob Baker
    5) Bob Satterfield
     
  3. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Ii6 Full Member

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    Are these on your list the only ones who we will evaluate, or could we keep going with others as well?
     
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  4. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft Pimp C's Full-Time Tutor blocked Full Member

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    • Archie Moore
    #1. Harold Johnson IV
    #2. Nino Valdez I
    #3. Jimmy Bivins II
    #4. Bob Satterfield
    #5. Bob Barker

    • Chris Byrd

    #1. Vitali Klitschko
    #2. David Tua
    #3. Evander Holyfield
    #4. Jameel McCline
    #5. Fres Oquendo

    • Sam Langford (at HW?)
    #1. Harry Wills V
    #2. Harry Wills II
    #3. Sam McVey
    #4. Joe Jeanette V
    #5. George Godfrey III

    • Jerry Quarry
    #1. Ron Lyle
    #2. Floyd Patterson II
    #3. Buster Mathis
    #4. Mac Foster
    #5. Earnie Shavers

    • Alexander Povetkin
    #1. Ruslan Chagaev
    #2. Chris Byrd
    #3. Mariusz Wach
    #4. Marco Huck
    #5. Eddie Chambers
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2020
  5. Gazelle Punch

    Gazelle Punch Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Can keep going w others. Lot of guys can be added
     
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  6. Gazelle Punch

    Gazelle Punch Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Love the list but kicking it off w Archie
     
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  7. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft Pimp C's Full-Time Tutor blocked Full Member

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    Edited.
     
  8. Jason Thomas

    Jason Thomas Active Member Full Member

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    I am glad you started this as it is taking a long time to get through the champions, and old guys like me don't have that much time to wait.

    I will stick to fights which are relevant to heavyweight status regardless of weight technicalities. However, I will not use fights clearly in a lower division against a great fighter who did nothing against heavyweights. So Harold Johnson counts for Moore, but Holman Williams doesn't.

    I will only use any fighter once regardless of how many victories the subject has over him.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2020
  9. Jason Thomas

    Jason Thomas Active Member Full Member

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    Archie Moore

    1-----Harold Johnson
    2-----Jimmy Bivins
    3-----Bob Baker
    4-----Nino Valdes
    5-----Clarence Henry

    Not making the cut. Joey Maxim--had been exclusively a tlight-heavyweight for several years, at least against name opponents. Could be on this list. Curtis Sheppard, Alejandro Lavorante, Bob Satterfield, etc. Moore has good depth at heavy for a contender.

    Baker over Valdes? Baker outpointed Valdes twice.

    What is missing from Moore is a win over a champion, but Johnson, Bivens, and Valdes have such wins. A lot depends on when one gets a fight against a champion to be or one who has been. Moore only fought champions at or near their peak.
     
  10. Gazelle Punch

    Gazelle Punch Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Almost added Henry and Maxim myself. To me Satterfield is such an odd fighter himself...if we get to him down the line his top five would look better then most champions yet he lost to many sub par fighters
     
  11. Jason Thomas

    Jason Thomas Active Member Full Member

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    some recommendations--Gunboat Smith, Frank Moran, Fred Fulton, Bill Brennan, Luis Angel Firpo, Ernie Schaaf, Tony Galento, Tommy Farr, Lee Savold, Joe Baksi, Paulino Uzcudun, Johnny Risko, Tommy Loughran

    I apologize up front if you have any of these men on your list.
     
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  12. Jason Thomas

    Jason Thomas Active Member Full Member

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    Satterfield is the type of guy who will be very interesting.
     
  13. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Gazelle, great subject matter. Regarding Moore's best heavyweight wins, I would lose Harold Johnson and Bob Satterfield whom I believe were both light heavies when Moore beat them and would not be relevant to the question (I'm doing this literal, as heavyweight only. I'm aware you mentioned best wins, but I'm trying to contain my picks for relevancy). Using my logic - for what it's worth - I would go with:

    1) Baker
    2) Valdez
    3) Bivins
    4) Clarence Henry
    5) Jimmy Slade

    Again, great subject matter.
     
  14. Jason Thomas

    Jason Thomas Active Member Full Member

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    this question of weights seems to really divide me from what I guess is the consensus.

    My take is there is a solid issue with Satterfield. Moore fought him in 1948 and Satterfield was not yet a heavyweight and had not beaten any heavyweights.

    Johnson though shows the problem with a hard and fast weight rule. He had beaten highly rated heavyweights before and would continue to do so. In the first two fights with Moore and his last two with Moore both men made 175. In the third fight, the only one Johnson won, Moore came in at 178. Does this mean that Johnson should get heavyweight credit for beating Moore, but Moore can't get such credit for beating Johnson?

    To me that doesn't make a lot of sense. We will each make these lists on our own criteria. Even if Johnson is not viewed as a heavyweight scalp, he still beat Valdes, Bivins, Henry, and Slade, and lost to none of them.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2020
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  15. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Ii6 Full Member

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    Archie's top 5:

    1. Harold Johnson
    2. Jimmy Bivins
    3. Nino Valdes
    4. Bob Baker
    5. Bob Satterfield

    Moore doesn't have the win against very top tier heavyweight, but he has excellent depth. A shame that he never fought against Walcott, this fight would have been interesting.
     


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