Best HW jabs: Louis, Liston, Ali, Holmes, Foreman, Lewis, Bruno, Douglas, Thomas, Bowe, W Klitschko

Louis has the best jab at HW imo.

 

I'll go with Holmes....
Especially when considering his jab was the difference between him being an ATG with it, or very average without it, because all his other attributes were average, other than the ability to recuperate.
Other fighters could've gotten by with an average jab.
Joe Louis still would be a deadly combination puncher if he had a average jab.
Ali still would've be a nightmare to try and trap and land cleanly if he had an average jab.
Liston still would've had a dangerous left hook and right hand with superior skills with an average jab.
Holmes had the best jab in history with power and speed.
That's tool is the reason for his success, and why he was able to have such a long career, and fight well into his mid 40's...

 

It's hard to pick one they are all better at certain things.

Douglas for snappiness and accuracy
Ali for speed and setting my combinations
Louis for using it to get in range and setting shots
Wlad for power and distance control as a range finder
Lewis for power and range
Holmes for versatility and while moving
Liston for power

Just give some examples.

 

Do you spend a second of your life without trashing on Klitschko? Did he beat you up as a kid or something?

 

He's a pathological liar and a hater. Probably can't help himself.

 

How can he be the best jabber while also being the most prolific hugger and illegal clincher in the divisions history.
That doesn't make any sense.
To understand better look how Vitali handled Peter .
Jabbed his face off. Zero clinching.
Then look at Wlad . Holding on for dear life minute after minute.
6 footer Eddie Chambers didn't need to grab and hold to beat Peter. If his jab was so great , why did Wlad?
Facts are facts.
Out of interest, Top 5 jabbing performances?

 

You can absolutely use both a great jab and a strong clinch. This was Muhammad Ali's whole game in like the mid 70s.

 

Like Frazier 2. Where Ali held excessively and had to fight the rubber to prove he could win without excessive clinching?
The result being almost beat to death against a top 10 ATG.

When did Klitschko fight Povetkin in a rematch with no clinching allowed? He'd never agree to it because he only knows how to win by fouling. His assistant trainer Ali Bashir said - look bad in this one and do better in the next.
Is training to illegally back hump Pov to death and never go near him again the same as facing joe Frazier 3 times in your book?
Ali produced jab clinic performances against the like of Sonny Liston. Ali's career wasn't defined by illegal holding.
Wlads entire run was aided by illegal holding.
There was no performance where he dominated the best he fought with the jab. Ali has those performances so your argument is bunk.

 

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Look at the terrible beating Ali took from Shavers. When his legs were gone and was half shot to pieces , he still didn't hold as much as Wlad.

 

Bowe had a good jab.. maybe not the best, but Bowe tried to hurt with every-single-punch he threw. Jab, hook, straight were all thrown to do damage.. so he would lean into his jab with super-heavy weight.

 

Literally all of this post was in your head. All I said was you can have two great aspects of your game. It's like saying you can't have a great left hook and a great right hand.

I don't see what you're actually saying. It seems like you want to believe that Wlad's jab wasn't the best because he used his clinch too much. That makes no sense. Wlad used both for control, just at different distances and they're best used alongside eachother. Ali was just an example; and in the fight you gave, he clearly uses both a great jab and a strong clinch. Does Mayweather not have a great jab coz he clinched Hatton? Does Hopkins not have a great jab coz he clinched Pavlik? What about Griffith or Carlos Ortiz?

Who wanted to sit through another Povetkin fight?

Who cares if Wlad didn't have a great jab performance (and he did anyway, Mercer, Chagaev, Joshua, Haye, etc), if Wlad used a great jab, in basically every single fight he ever had.

 

No , you said Wlad and 70's Ali were the same because they both hit and held. The post above was responding directly to that claim.
Plus , Ali fought many clean fights in the 70's. Bugner , Patterson , Quarry , Norton.

You don't see what im saying? No you just dont have an answer for it , so you have to present illegal clinching as a legitimate tactical skill.

The only thing you got right is Wlad using illegal clinch to control opponents . He relied heavily on a variety of bear hugs , squid grabs and back humps for one reason only -- failure to keep guys on the outside with jab but also with movement. Wlad couldn't fight off the backfoot.
So his jab was only effective if guys were standing right in front of him like 42 Mercer and Chagaev on short notice. He was deducted a point for excessive clinching against Haye. Weird since Haye apparently ran away all night. Why was he clinching a guy on the backfoot?

The jab is often first line of offensive and defence. Wlad had no inside skill. If his jab failed he went straight for the illegal grab.
That happened for almost the entirety of his fight against the best he fought.
If his jab was so good , he would never have needed to resort to so many fouls.
The fouls he was allowed to commit were referee dependant. Remove his dependency on fouls and he's easier to beat.
Thats what happened to him against Brewster.

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What do you see here? Pov in in range for the jab. What does Wlad do ? He leads with the same type of offensive clinching as Lawernce Okoile.

There's no jab -hugging hybrid . The jab is the jab. You can either use it clean or you can't.

 

Absolutely.

 

Shut up Dino. Wlad holds a little just like countless old timers which is apart of boxing. It's funny how you say Wlad had "no inside skill" when he can turn a left hook 6 inches away into a knockout blow.

 

You're weird man. I said this "You can absolutely use both a great jab and a strong clinch. This was Muhammad Ali's whole game in like the mid 70s." I at no point said Wlad and 70's Ali were the same because they both hit and held.

If the referee doesn't take a point away, it's legal. And the clinch is a legitimate tactic, because it works. You not liking it is your own problem.

"You don't see what im saying? No you just dont have an answer for it" I don't see what you're saying because it makes no sense and is clearly you using this thread as a chance to **** on Wlad, as you have always done.