Better 154 lbs, DLH or JC Vasquez?

Oscar de la Hoya.

 

A lot of people that are in the HOF shouldn't be there.

As for Cotto, you'll have to excuse me for nothing thinking the world of him for beating up Zab Judah and crawling over the line against a 36 year old Mosley.

As for Shane himself, he's basically had one great performance at welterweight, but other than that, he has shown vulnerabilities. I think Buddy could trouble him with his jab and movement.

 

all buddy really did is win that one fight against simon brown, so its not like hes really better than him.

 

Brown was his only super win, but Buddy's body of work at 147 is more solid than Mosley's. Guys like Oliva and Leon are better than any of Mosley's second best wins at the weight. His losses at the weight were more respectable than Mosley's as well.

 

what makes genaro leon a better fighter than luis collazo or antonio diaz? Please inform me. Beating de la hoya at welterweight is far more impressive than beating simon brown. He lost to vernon forrest big deal. Mcgirt is 1-4 against ronnie shields/george benton fighters, isnt he?

 

He just about had Buddy ready to go in their fight in the last couple of rounds, and Buddy is a much more credentialed fighter at 147 than Ricky Hatton is - a close loss to whom is Luis Collazo's claim to fame. Leon dislocated his shoulder after the McGirt fight and never re-established himself. As for Antonio Diaz, I'm not sure what could possibly be his claim to fame at 147. If we're going to mention fighters that did something at lower weights, then I'll mention the Tony Baltazars, Joe Manleys, Saoul Mambys and Rafael Williamses on McGirt's welterweight ledger.

It's more impressive but not far more impressive. I mean DLH's welterweight career had him arguably losing to both an old Whitaker and Ike Quartey. Brown actually had a decent run at the weight. Not facing the opponents DLH did, but a decent run nonetheless. I wouldn't say DLh was FAR more impressive than Simon Brown at the weight. DLh actually impressed me more before he got to 147. I think his peak came before he even entered the 147 ranks.

He didn't just lose to Vernon Forrest. He got dominated by Forrest. In the first fight at least. Second fight was closer, but still a clear loss.

He is. 2 of those losses coming at 140, not 147 and those being to Meldrick Taylor on a night he was recovering from an ailment and the other being Frankie Warren, who he beat in a rematch.

At welterweight (the weight we are discussing here) he lost twice to Pernell Whitaker, and once by a narrow margin. And is there anyone willing to dispute that Pernell Whitaker was a better welterweight than Vernon Forrest? (I'll tell you one thing, no one that has seen their sparring sessions would think so).

 

He got dominated by vernon forrest, but yeah buddy mcgirt doesnt have the physical traits of a forrest now does he? They are the exact same size.

 

MCgirt has a good jab and a good right hand, the two key tools employed by Forrest to beat Mosley. He isn't as tall or rangy as Forrest, but he is slicker and his movement will trouble Mosley. Could Mosley beat him? Sure, and it wouldn't surprise me if he did. But I don't see it as unequivocally as you do.

 

To me mcgirt is more of an ike quartey type fighter, vernon forrest is more like his teacher mark breland, except his chin is alot better.

 

Forrest is Breland with a chin, but Quartey and McGirt are worlds apart when it comes to movement and styles of defense.

 

I meant they are similar with great jabs and good right hands, ofcourse ike has the better jab, but mcgirt has the better left hook. Something he didnt seem to land in the whitaker fights.

By the way, how did you score the ike-lopez and ike de la hoya fights?

 

Agreed.

Though I think even if he had use fo the left hook, it would have been hard for Buddy to land it clean, given Whitaker's southpaw style. A lot of good left hookers struggled to hit Whitaker with it (DLH, Chavez and even Tito to an extent. Tito enjoyed most of his success with the right hand lead, a punch southpaws in general and Whitaker himself was vulnerable to).

Both as 114-114 draws.

DLH winning rounds 1,3,4,10 and 12( 10-8 ).
Quartey winning rounds 2,5,6,7,8 and 9.
Round 11 being even.

Lopez winning rounds 2,8,10,11( 10-8 ) and 12.
Quartey winning rounds 1,3,4,5,6 and 9.
Round 7 being even.

 

Vasquez by a mile. And I still think he beat Sweat Pea in their fight.

 

How did you score it Seamus?

 

Bumpety bump.

Finally saw the complete Vasquez-Castillejo fight.

An excellent fight that I recommend everyone watch. Was brutal as hell in the trenches - which is where pretty much the whole fight was fought. Vasquez was super impressive with his left rips to the body, and though Castillejo was outmuscled most of the rounds, he kept on firing back and showed great heart throughout.

My scorecard for the fight: 117-113 for Vasquez.

Rounds 3,8 and 9 for Castillejo, rounds 2,4,5,6,7,10,11 and 12 for Vasquez and round 1 even. Pretty accurate call from my Argie mate.

You could probably argue that Castillejo won 5 rounds if you give him every benefit of the doubt, but there's no doubt he got clearly beaten.