Better all round fighter Max Schmeling or Riddick Bowe?

Nah cos I'd give Baer an extra 50 pounds and then he crushes Schmelling again.

 

Schmelling getting knocked out might have to do with actually facing a number of highly ranked opponents some of whom were bigger than him.

Had Bowe fought Tyson, Ruddock, Lewis, McCall, etc he would probably have a few knockout losses. He generally steered clear of his eras big punchers.

He is also lucky the Golota rematch wasn't a stoppage loss, many referees would have stopped it to save Bowe serious injury.

 

I'm not sure about that, although it's fair statement.

Maybe because of size, but P4P no way.

I don't know, Schmeling outjabbed fighters with longer jabs than his own. Did Bowe ever do that?

Again, I'm not sure. Bowe was great for someone that large but he wasn't that special P4P.

Probably, but Bowe chin wasn't tested. Schmeling had good chin.

Most of that is because of size though.

I can't see 6'1 190 lbs Bowe beating Schmeling. He had poor defense and without physical advantages he would be dominated by much more refined Max.

 

Again, he faced better competition though.

 

Bowe was good for his size, don't get me wrong but he'd be destroyed by fighters like Louis or Sharkey without physical advantages. I'm not even sure if he'd beat them with his real dimensions to be fair.

Schmeling fought them and beat them. Schmeling's defense, timing, skills and ring IQ are galaxies from Riddick. Bowe was great because he was good at that size, not because he was great P4P.

 

bowe

 

Max's skill level and ring iq tend to get a bit overstated, I agree, but compared to Bowe he was light years ahead. Max's timing, defence, his command of distance, his punch variety and his ability to stick to gameplans targeting his opponents' weaknesses were all superior to Bowe's one dimensional come-forward roughhousing that treated every opponent the same way.

Look at any Bowe fight and you'll more than likely see the same pattern emerging, Bowe plodding slowly forward taking shots through his high guard, then slugging away once he gets within his opponent's wheelhouse. On the occasions his opponent wouldn't play ball (Golota fights, Larry Donald fight) he looks lost, and his effectiveness drops considerably.

Max would lose to Bowe of course because he wouldn't be able to keep him off him, but in a P4P sense there's really no comparison.

 

Wlad was essentially a 240lbs Schmeling, with less punch variety.

 

But he also faced inferior competition, some of whom also knocked him out

 

I disagree with almost every word in this post.

 

He was knocked out only twice at heavyweight - against Baer and Louis. Bowe never faced as good puncher as either one of them.

 

As well as Gipsy Daniels

 

It was at LHW, wasn't it? Either way, Gypsy wasn't bad at all.

 

Was Bowe that athletic? His feet were stuck in concrete, and his reflexes seemed pretty poor to me (or perhaps he just didn't consider actually avoiding shots a priority). He was quick for a big man, and could throw fluid combos when he needed to, but he wasn't what I'd call a tremendous all-round athlete.

He beat Holyfield because Holyfield fought the dumbest fight imaginable, pitting himself up against all of Bowe's strengths rather than exploiting his weaknesses. It made for a great crowd-pleasing contest, but it was only going to end one way. Holyfield adapted in the second fight and fought the way he should have done, controlled aggression with a degree of out-boxing, for which Bowe had no answer.

I agree with your breakdown, although I've always found Bowe's jab to be quite poor when compared to other SHWs of the time. Powerful and fast, but poor timing and inconsistent with it. Schmeling's jab wasn't as snappy as Bowe's but he understood how to use it to control range, draw his opponent's fire, and open them up to scoring blows. It was a cornerstone of his style. With Bowe it was an afterthought.