Better Legacy: Hopkins or RJJ

Until Erdei had beaten Gonzalez, he'd beaten nobody of note.

We know that Gonzalez wasn't anything special, and we know that Dariusz was faded when he fought him. I don't think many people would have picked Gonzalez to have beaten a prime Dariusz.

So say if Roy had had beaten Erdei in 2004, instead of facing Tarver again, how would it have been a big win at the time?

The WBO were still lightly regarded then, and it had only been a few years after the Darrin Morris incident. A lot of respected sports writers etc had zero respect for them.

I find it very strange that you think it would have been classed as a great win.

Beating a guy who held the WBO belt who'd beaten nobody apart from Gonzalez, would not have been a big win.

It's just nonsense.

 

Erdei was an undefeated champ who made his first defence against undefeated Garay. Tarver had not won a defence at that time and won a title from a fighter who would be beat by the fighter Erdei won his title from.
Erdei was less known but I think a far greater LHW than Tarver

 

Jones first fight with Tarver had some debate to it

 

I didn't look at the videos just the text: I guess some might argue he was being a smart businessman. He certainly fought very tough people in his career.

By embarassing I just meant regarding his recent record with all the knockouts.


Reading that article I think i have more sympathy for RJJ and it sounds like he had a rough time and really worked hard to get where he was. He seems like he might be a decent guy.

I think someone needs to tell him that trying to get another title at this point is costing him a lot with all the losses/knockouts. I also think that a clear MRI today doesn't mean a clear one tomorrow. I hope he doesn't end up really hurting himself.

 

I have no doubt.:rofl

 

The referee decisions make it hard to score correctly. The swing rounds were round 5 and 6 when most of the crazy stuff happened.

What was your score for RJJ Hop 2? After watching the bout several times I have it scored overruling Tony Weeks.

Tony Weeks had a tough assignment and did admirably throughout the bout, but I didn’t agree with some of his decisions like deducting a point from RJJ when Hops was sent down.

 

I thought Hopkins could have very well been counted out.. I forgot what round it was but I remember him going down from a borderline low blow, that really wasn't truly low IMO.

 

Yeah the double hook. That was later in the fight, hit bottom edge of belt line, and the punch was moving upward. Not a low blow.

 

Just watched it again Mind Reader, what made that on the border was the fact that Hopkins was walking forward as Roy was throwing the double hook. When Roy “aimed” that body shot in the double left hook combo, it was aimed at Hops body. But Hopkins started walking forward so it hit the belt line instead of the body. It wasn’t aimed low.

 

:good

 

bailey,

I retract my previous statement.

I won't criticise Bernard for remaining at MW at that specific point in time.

After defending his IBF belt numerous times in the mid 90's, it became apparent that he wasn't going to be in a position to unify anytime soon at that point.

Again, look at who was in his division at that point, and look at who was at SMW-LHW.

Again, Roy left SMW after only 2 years, even though he could have remained there for a long time.

Yeah.

Talk is cheap, especially after a fight when a fighter's full of adrenaline.

Look at Bernard and Roy's famous HBO argument.

Bernard told everyone how much he wanted Roy. But after the dust had settled, he didn't want it. Again, if the loss to Roy had literally been on his mind since the day it happened, then that speaks volumes.

Most definitely. In my opinion, he'd have been more open to fighting Collins, had he have held a major belt.

True, but I don't think he beat guys as easy as what Roy did.

It just depends on the circumstances.

Regarding Roy, there's more than enough evidence out there, that proves that he did try and fight the best to clear out the divisions.

I respect that. Again, it's just circumstances. You need the opportunity. As great as Floyd was, he never beat a fellow ATG whilst they were prime.

:good

Again, he refused $6m and then didn't fight for 13 months.

:good

True, but you can't overlook the fact that Roy was once a JMW who went on to win a version of a HW title. That's rare.

:good

 

If you think Erdei was a better fighter than Tarver, that's cool.

You're entitled to your opinion. But in my opinion, Roy wouldn't have gotten much credit due to the factors that I noted in my previous post.

Again, apart from Gonzalez, Erdei had beaten nobody of note in 2004, and Roy had already beaten Gonzalez with ease 3 years earlier.

 

teemy,

I think it was a mixture of being smart and having a lack of ambition. And that has to be factored in to this debate.

I agree on all accounts.

It appears that he's finally given up on his title quest.

I'm expecting a farewell fight against a low level opponent at some point.

:good

 

Ra's Al-Ghul,

I respect everything that you've written.

I'm just looking from the perspective of if Roy had fought him in 2004.

Yes, it was Dariusz's old lineal title, but Gonzalez had beaten a faded version of Dariusz, and Roy had beaten Gonzalez with absolute ease 3 years before Erdei did. Again, apart from beating Gonzalez, at the time, Erdei had beaten nobody of note. He was unknown back then. So due to circumstances, I don't think it would have been a big fight, and I don't think Roy would have gotten much credit had he have beaten him. Maybe overtime he may have done, but not in 2004.

Good points.

:good