Better resume - Jack Sharkey or Max Schmeling

We don't have any evidences of that. You're just making up this thing.

Interesting, given that Ruhlin beat Choynski when both were in their primes. They are close, but Ruhlin seems to be better fighter overall.

Goddard beat him twice and lost once when he was past his prime. Goddard was much more consistent fighter.

McCoy had many fights at heavyweight. He beat Choynski twice and they drew once. Again, I don't see any reason to pick Joe much higher over him.

That's more understendable, but it's important to note that in their most important fight (first one) when they faced each other for eliminator Maher knocked him out silly. Both were at their best then. You can rank Joe higher because of 1900s career and two wins over past prime Peter, but it's close.

This one is indefensible. Fitzsimmons dominated him in their figth and draw was announced only because the fight was stopped by Police when Joe got knocked out. Fitzsimmons resume is much better, he was much more consistent fighter and has far better wins.

Sharkey beat Choynski before he reached his prime (Joe was in his prime then). He was definitely a better fighter.

Nice, but the problem is that this draw seems to be a fluke, because Corbett stopped him quickly after this bout.

I agree, O'Brian was better fighter than Hart. He has fantastic resume and is underrated P4P in my opinion.

 

But this is not true at all, certainly not to a point of ranking him "much higher".

I'm talking about Charles Kid McCoy.

Again, it's indefensible.

Fitzsimmons had longer and more successful career.

He had some of his best fights after 1895. There is no reason to call him past his best in 1896-98.

 

This is not true in any way, shape or form. Fitzsimmons had better and more wins, less losses and he dominated Joe in their H2H fight.

 

So Choynski's 2 or 3 years advantage (when he wasn't top contender anyway) is more worthy than Fitzsimmons dominating the division for many years, including domination of Choynski and having far better results against the same competition? I understand everything fine, Fitzsimmons was far better fighter than Choynski with much better resume at heavyweight.

So you accuse Fitzsimmons for cheating because he was small? This is very weak argument without anything to back it up. I can say that all great punchers cheated then, because you won't prove me wrong right?

 

Fitzsimmons already fought at heavyweight after his Dempsey fight. He fought Peter Maher in 1892 for the first time.

In 1892-02 (until second Jeffries fight) he posted 35-3-2 including wins over Sharkey, Ruhlin, Daly, Corbett, Maher and Hall. He also had a draw with Choynski which should have been a win and win over Creedon who (although small) also fought at heavyweight. His only losses are against Jeffries and robbery DQ against Sharkey. He also beat Gardner and O'Brian after 1902.

In short, Fitzsimmons cleaned out division and he lost only to Jeffries in his prime. Choynski is not even close to him.

He wasn't, stop it. This is ridiculous.

Nobody questioned Fitzsimmons techinque at that time. In fact many fighters praised Fitz and said that they tried to use similar technique to Bob.

 

Where did you get that from? The fight was stopped when Choynski was out of steam and helpless.

 

If that was the case, then they would have beaten him. Fitzsimmons faced all of the best contenders of his era and he beat all of them except Jeffries.

 

Seriously? Are you really using Johnson fight as a proof of Fitz weakness? He was almost 50 years old then and he had injured hands.

 

Yeah and he was knocked out before police intervention. Bob beat him cleanly.

Not only, because he also lost.

Are you comparing novice Jeffries that Joe fought with experienced verison of Jeffries that beat Fitz? Come on...

Cool, Fitzsimmons knocked out Sharkey twice.

 

Coming back to the topic, I just rewatched first Schmeling vs Sharkey fight:

This content is protected

It's true that Sharkey was winning before low blow, but some of so called "domination" is overstated. Sharkey won 3rd round convincingly (he hurt Schmeling) and was winning 4th, but first two rounds were close (especially first one).

 

I've created new thread about Fitzsimmons vs Choynski. Feel free to post there, don't do it on Max vs Jack thread.

https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/bob-fitzsimmons-vs-joe-choynski-at-hw.648932/

 

I disagree, as Corbett was still green against Choynski. I also disagree that rematch would have ended differently - Fitz struggled at first with Corbett's quickness and unorthodox style but he adjusted his strategy and was winning second half of the fight before knockout. In my opinion, Bob would knock him out faster in rematch of anything.

You are probably the only one who thinks this way on this forum.