Boxers That Retired At the Right Time?

Saintpat · May 29, 2023

Pugguy said: ↑

The Stooges? Wise Guy, Huh

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If you look at the first Stooges album, the band member names are listed as Iggy Stooge, Scott Stooge, Ron Stooge, etc.

Was the idea of their manager at the time, whose name I forget. They got rid of him and got rid of the Stooge last names (although they became Iggy and the Stooges).

The same guy later managed a band from New York and named the band members Joey Ramone, Dee Dee Ramone, Tommy Ramone, etc. I’ll give him credit for sticking to his one idea. (But what a musical family those Ramones were.)

If you’ve never read “Please Kill Me,” the oral history of the origins of the punk movement in NYC (and beyond), I highly recommend it. So many great stories, so much craziness, so much … heroin. Starts with the Velvet underground and goes through the breakup of the Sex Pistols and Sid Vicious killing Nancy Spungen, which was kind of the end of the original punk scene.

Fergy · May 30, 2023

Anubis said: ↑

Marciano was asked in the ring after knocking out Moore about reaching a magic number of 50 wins. Rocky was more than willing to try, but also getting sick of Al Weil's shenanigans.

He'd have wanted to go out with a win as memorable as Moore, but against who in 1956? Patterson was still virtually a MW and wouldn't bump his weight up until after Marciano was gone. Archie himself in a rematch? He won 11 bouts in 1956 before Patterson got him on November 30. Keep in mind again that Floyd wouldn't even contemplate the HW division until Rocky was gone.

Bob Baker was the #2 HW contender behind the Mongoose in 1955. Baker was in Ring's top ten in 1950 (#5), 1951 (#9), 1954 (#4), 1955 (#2), and 1956 (#8). He'd paid his dues in time for a final Marciano challenge, and was indeed discussed as a potential final opponent.

Maybe a stick and move guy, like Pastrano, who was hot in 1956 and ended 1955 by decisioning Rex Layne. Willie was 34-4-5 after McMurtry in August 1956. In 1955, Pastrano was the #5 HW (Patterson wasn't in the top ten then), in 1956, Willie was #4, and in 1957 he was #3. 1958 saw Pastrano as the #5 HW. From 1955 to 1958, Willie Pastrano was the only HW Ring Magazine always had in their top ten HWs. He was never decked by a head shot.

Undefeated Eddie Machen had a great sophomore year in 1956, and maybe the twin wins over big Nino Valdez gets him to Rocky in late 1956, although only at 15/16/17/18-0.

Nino himself? He was #1 in 1953 and 1954 behind Marciano, #6 in 1955 and 1957. However interesting the optics would've been though, he sputtered in 1955 and 1956.

Welsh cutie Joe Erskine beat Johnny Williams over the Championship Distance for the British HW Title on August 31, 1956. This left Erskine at 29-0-1. In 1957, he scaled 198 for Cooper II, a decision win over the Championship Distance. Against Pastrano in 1959, Erskine actually imposed his will and did the sticking and moving better in a masterful chess match. You can see Erskine's style in extant footage.

The great Harold Johnson sputtered badly in 1954 and 1955, leaving him out of title consideration for challenging or succeeding Rocky.

Fans wanted to see fireworks, but Pastrano was tough, highly skilled, experienced, and he'd get himself into the best condition of his career for Marciano. Willie would get taken out at some point, but fans would be satisfied after that it would be the perfect time for Rocky to hang 'em up.
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Love these type of what if s, in your posts, Anubis. Really well thought out and gives food for thought.
The two big what ifs for me have always been, Marciano going on longer and Gene.
Both had a little left perhaps but yes, it depends who they actually met.
Rocky would probably have faced Floyd and that could have been Patterson s worse nightmare or Rock s ending.
Gene Tunney, I don't see him lasting too long as champ, the younger gen coming up, at some point, maybe a year or two later, are catching up with him.

Richard M Murrieta · May 30, 2023

Saintpat said: ↑

If you look at the first Stooges album, the band member names are listed as Iggy Stooge, Scott Stooge, Ron Stooge, etc.

Was the idea of their manager at the time, whose name I forget. They got rid of him and got rid of the Stooge last names (although they became Iggy and the Stooges).

The same guy later managed a band from New York and named the band members Joey Ramone, Dee Dee Ramone, Tommy Ramone, etc. I’ll give him credit for sticking to his one idea. (But what a musical family those Ramones were.)

If you’ve never read “Please Kill Me,” the oral history of the origins of the punk movement in NYC (and beyond), I highly recommend it. So many great stories, so much craziness, so much … heroin. Starts with the Velvet underground and goes through the breakup of the Sex Pistols and Sid Vicious killing Nancy Spungen, which was kind of the end of the original punk scene.
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1984's The Curley Shuffle.

Flo_Raiden · May 30, 2023

Barney Ross retiring after losing to Henry Armstrong by decision. He left the sport after a courageous effort against Armstrong.

MrPook · May 31, 2023

FMJ

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