Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Hookie, Aug 4, 2013.
Both at their best, who wins?
Braddock was taller with a longer reach, similar in weight. Braddock was very durable and didnt cut as easily as Quarry. He beat big strong guys with power like Baer, he outboxed good boxers like John Henry Lewis, he even dropped Joe Louis in the first round and gave him a tough fight before being stopped in the 8th.
Braddock during most of his career was a feared puncher. Later on he developed more of a boxers style but always had a dangerous right hand.
Quarry was a busier fighter than Braddock...perhaps just as quick but really impossible to say for sure. Quarry liked to counterpunch which may have been tough with Braddock.
I can see the bout going either way...I'll go with Jimmy by decision in a close bout. Quarry does well early while Braddock closes the show.
Quarry was the better of the two, and by a good margin. Quarry via UD.
Jimmy just too tough and well focused mentally for head case Jerry. Watch the first four rounds of Louis-Braddock again. Before arthritis began hampering him in the fifth, Jim fearlessly more than held his own with the Bomber.
Although JQ is much the more talented physically, this one's decided between the ears and in the mind. Braddock did it over 15 rounds against Lasky and the Larruper in back to backs. As Champion, he had ridiculous experience behind him. No version of Jerry takes the Jimmy Braddock of 1935.
What film have you seen on Braddock besides the tank job by Max Baer? I have Braddock vs Loughran, and its not close.
Braddock was essentially an active journeyman with toughness, but he wasn't skilled, big, strong, or fast. IMO, he's the least talented of lineal heavyweight champions. Quarry could have been champion in other eras.
Quarry has just about every edge over Braddock, and would likely tee off on him. I am surprised at the opinions in this thread.
Wow--The records do not show this. Which top ten ranked fighter did Braddock knock out? Braddock a feared puncher?
I picked Quarry on points. I think he is a seriously underrated fighter. Braddock DID give Louis a really tough fight, though. I don't see a cakewalk for Jerry.
Braddock was a big puncher at light heavy and still had a decent sock at heavy but had very bad hands ... That being said I like a prime Quarry by decision .. fought and defeated much better heavyweights ..
"Only Max Baer could hit harder than Jimmy Braddock." -Joe Louis, who rated Braddock over Schmeling, Galento, Buddy Baer and JJW as a puncher.
In 97 fights, only four people knocked out Tuffy Griffiths. Braddock was the first [which really launched Jimmy's career]. One of the other two was Max Baer. In 129 outings, Jimmy Slattery was stopped four times. Shade [earlier on], Belanger [near the end] and Berlenbach were the other three culprits. Braddock did it closest to Slattery's peak. Arthritis and hand problems came to hinder his ability to consistently load up severely, but there are multiple camera angles of him putting Louis on the floor. Unlike Schmeling I, Joe was ready and in proper condition for Braddock. That film offers a clue about how he could hit.
This one wouldn't be decided by power though, but concentration. Jimmy was internally tougher.
I think you're blowing it up at heavyweight. I never read that quote by Louis anywhere. I sincelely doubt he hit harder than Galento, Schmeling , Buddy Baer or Walcott let alone Marciano. Braddock had a good right hand for a light heavyweight and a solid one at heavy. He was not a top thirty puncher at heavy.. Another funny thing about this Louis quote. Louis famously questioned Max Baers power saying he did not feel it at all in their fight. Finally, the Braddock knockdown of Louis was a flash.
Braddock started his career something like 35-5-3 with 20 kos. After his loss to Loughran his hands were in very bad shape and he had no money to get a doctors treatment. After the crash in 29 he had to work on the NJ docks to support his family so no time for training and he took bouts on a days notice. This started his downhill slide and what you see are many losses that do not reflect his potential ability as a fighter. However if you read newspaper accounts everyone wrote about the Braddock right hand. Johnson in fact mentioned it prior to Jims bout with Louis....that it could ko the bomber. Anyway...the idea that Braddock had a great right is common knowledge. No need to start revisionist history on this also!
I agree so let's go with fact. How many top ten heavyweights did he ko? He sure never made Max Baer blink. The record you refer to is as a light heavy. Again I ask, how many top ten heavyweights did he ko?
Quarry fought some of the best heavyweight ever... but he didn't do very well vs. any of them. Frazier stopped him twice, Ali stopped him twice, and Norton stopped him. Out of these 5 KO defeats, he did the best in his first fight vs. Frazier. Quarry had his moments before being stopped after 7 rounds... 1969 Ring Magazine fight of the year.
He was also stopped by George Chuvalo in the 7th round in late 1969.
Ali stopped him inside of 3 in 1970. He turned the trick inside of 7 in 1972.
Frazier stopped him inside of 5 rounds in 1974.
Norton stopped him inside of 5 rounds in 1975.
He had 3 draws vs. less than good fighters prior to facing Eddie Machen.
He was clearly outboxed over 10 rounds by a past prime Eddie Machen in 1966.
In early 1967 he fought a 3-8-2 (1) fighter named Al Jones. Jones dropped Quarry twice before being stopped at the end of the 5th round.
He drew with a past prime but well prepared Floyd Patterson in 1967, D10. Patterson was down twice, Quarry was down once. A lot of people thought Patterson deserved the win.
In a rematch vs. Patterson 4 1/2 months later (this time part of the WBA HW tournament), Quarry won by MD after 12 rounds. Patterson was down once. Again, a lot of people thought Patterson deserved the win.
Ellis successfully defended the WBA HW title by MD vs. Quarry in 1968.
He beat an up and coming but pre-peaked Ron Lyle in 1973, W12.
He stopped the hard punching but not so durable Ernie Shavers in 1973, KO1.
Some people like to talk up his overall boxing ability. He had decent skills but he was far from a great technician. Sure, he looks very good vs. lower level guys but against the best HWs he faced he was pulverized.
Braddock... you have to look at his best years for this. He had ups and downs and fought injured in order to feed his family. Things were much different in those days. Let's look at his best.
In the last 5 years of Braddock's career (1933-1938) he went 9-5 (2) 1NC overall and 1-1 in HW World title fights. 4 of those losses he could have actually won had he not suffered hand injuries... the other was to Louis.
He beat Martin Levandowski by decision in their first fight (1933). In the rematch (3 months later) he lost a MD to Levandowski, he had broken his hand in the first round.
He knocked out Al Stillman in the 10th round of their first fight (1933). Stillman won the rematch (2 months later) by close decision, Braddock broke his hand in the 1st round after dropping Stillman.
In 1934 he beat Corn Griffin (KO3) and John Henry Lewis (W10). He dropped Lewis in the 5th. Lewis had decisioned Braddock in 1932. This was a much better Braddock and the same old Lewis.
In 1935 he won 15 round decisions over Art Lasky and Max Baer (won the HW Title).
He lost the HW title to Joe Louis in 1937 but dropped Louis in the 1st round and gave him fit before being stopped in the 8th. Braddock was only stopped twice. In his only other stoppage loss... he had been cut in a fight that he lost by decision... 2 weeks later he fought again and the cut was reopened resulting in a 6 round stoppage due to that cut.
Braddock went out with a win, W10 Tommy Farr.
Either resume can be picked apart to be honest. Quarry has some notable wins... Patterson, Lyle, and Shavers... but Patterson was past prime and still won in the minds of many, Lyle was green, and Shavers getting knocked out by a decent HW was nothing shocking. Braddock beat Tuffy Griffiths, John Henry Lewis, and Max Baer. When Quarry lost it was badly. When Braddock lost he still lasted the distance (except twice), but he didn't fight Ali and Frazier.
I'll take Braddock by close decision.