Bradley vs Hatton

I think Hatton gets a bit underrated these days he only lost to the very best and he was a force at 140 in his prime. For me Bradley was a good fighter but he didn't excell in any one area. I wasn't overly high over Bradley to be quite honest he was a good all rounder but I don't think he was anything special quite honestly.

 

Where is this nonsense that Hatton had no power come from?
32 KOs in 45 fights
One-punch stoppages in big fights against, Maussa and Castillo and a few more as he coming up against lesser fighter. Had the tough Paulie Malinaggi hanging on for dear life after a big shot in round 2. Hatton could punch.
I'd favour Bradley as he was better technically and had a hell of a chin, but Hatton had faster feet, bigger puncher and likely the stronger of the two. Hatton also didn't draw with journeymen.

I'd lean towards Bradley at his best to win narrowly on points a bit better technically, more adaptable but it's close fight and Hatton is absolutely live in it. Both men know they have been in a fight after this.

 

Depends on what You mean by special - but I think his resume speaks for itself.

Hatton was a good champion at 140, although He competed in rather weak era and He doesn't have any stand-out wins beyond past-prime Tszyu. I think He got a gift against Collazo as well, so He wasn't very effective moving up.
Bradley has less depth at Super Lightweight, but He more than makes up for it with his accomplishments at 147. I don't think He gets enough credit for beating Pacquiao in 2012.

I think styles favor Bradley as well. To me - He'd be very tough match-up for any pressure fighter without 1-punch knock-out power. Bradley would not get tired, He could box and handle himself on the inside and He was strong and rugged. Not difficult to press guy like that effectively.

 

He wasn't featherfisted, but do You think He could hurt Bradley with single shot? I don't see it. He had good left hook to the body, but I don't recall ever seeing Bradley hurt with a body shot.

 

Mainly because he didn't beat Pac and absolute joke of a decision one of the worst you will see.

 

Close fight, one that Bradley won fairly - in my opinion.

Only joke on that night was HBO commentary:

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Well speaking of Bradley's resume realistically he didn't beat Pacquiao the 1st fight is considered a robbery so on 95 percent of fans scorecards Bradley is comfortably 0-3 vs Pacquiao.

A good solid close win over JMM but Welterweight isn't JMM's best weight by a long shot and he was 40 years old.

Bradley was lucky to survive vs Provodnikov 30 more seconds and he was done for and there was also a clear knockdown in the 1st round that wasn't called that would've made a huge difference in the scoring. Because Bradley only won by 1 point on 2 of the judges scorecards so if the knockdown is scored in the 1st round the fight is a draw.

Lucky to survive again vs Vargas another 30 more seconds he may of been stopped in that fight aswell.

Dropped twice vs Holt who is good but not elite.

I think Bradley is overrated honestly he was a solid fighter and a good all rounder but for me as i said nothing special and he showed quite a few weaknesses in numerous fights.

 

In regards to media scores 90 scored it for Pacquiao only 10 for Bradley it was a bad decision no way Bradley won it. He was more competitive than maybe people make out but Bradley certainly didn't win the fight.

And it's no surprise that "CJ Ross" the same judge who had Canelo vs Mayweather a draw had Bradley beating Pacquiao.

 

I knew bunch of people who scored it differently after watching it again. HBO did a lot to influence people on that night. When You hear commentator scream "ANOTHER BIG LEFT HAND BY PACUQIAO" after every punch, landed or not - particulary with a lot of people are watching fights with friends, talking and drinking in the meantime - it will have an impact on your perception.
CJ Ross scored most fights correctly, so not sure what that proves. Now if someone feels Pacquiao won, I have no problems with it - but it wasn't even close to a robbery.

As for that "list of shame" for Bradley's career, same can be done for Hatton. Barely edging Eamonn Magee, having to be saved by his cutman on multiple occasions, fighting spoon-fed opposition of past-prime veterans and club fighters for years, catching Tszyu and Castillo at the right time, being gifted second division title - and being outclassed on two occasions He stepped up against elite fighters in their prime. Outclassed in a way that noone was ever able to do it against Bradley.

Now, it's just sort of a game - to be clear. Hatton was a good champion and I just want to show that You can cherry pick extreme arguments for almost every fighter like that.
I feel that Bradley was better, accomplished more and would win - maybe not easily, but convincingly - had They fought.

 

I think you're fighting a losing battle trying to justify Bradley's decision win over Pacquiao as legitimate. Most of the media scored it for Pacquiao, the vast majority of fans scored for Pacquiao, they even appointed 5 WBO judges to rescore the fight and they all had Pacquiao clearly winning 115-111, 116-112, 117-111, 117-111, 118-110. I don't like using punchstats but Pacquiao out landed Bradley in 10 out of the 12 rounds aswell so there isn't really many strong arguments for Bradley quite honestly.

So for me it's clearly a robbery because i can't fathom how anyone could think Bradley won 7 rounds in the fight, a competitive fight can still be classed as a robbery if there's logically no mathematically way Bradley can win the fight if you're watching it with an unbiased view. I scored it 116-112 for Pacquiao i thought it was competitive but a clear win for Pacquiao.

Hence based on everything i said above i don't consider it a legit win for Bradley so that win doesn't mean much to me. You can give him credit for being competitive but for the win ? that's a massive stretch.

As for CJ Ross you're saying she scored most fights right but she had two horrendous scorecards in two huge fights 115-113 for Bradley is bad enough but 114-114 for Canelo vs Mayweather ? that's inexcusable.

There's also other sus scoring from CJ Ross i'll quote you this post.

Two out of Three judges at ringside score it an easy win for manny, Ross scores it 113-115 Bradley.

Nov 12 2011 Burgos-Cruz

Two out of three judges score it an easy win for Burgos, Ross calls it a draw.

AUG 13 2011 Agbeko-Mares

Two Judges give Mares the win, Ross scores it a draw

July 23 2011 Judah-Jastrzebski

Two judges score Judah the winner, Ross calls it a draw

May 7 2011 Mayol-Gallo

Two judges score in favor of Mayol, Ross scores it a draw

July 3 2009 Romero-Springer

Two judges score Romero the winner, Ross scores it 37-39 Springer

Feb 7 2008 Holt-Tackie

According to two judges Holt, wins the fight convincingly, Ross call it a draw

July 28 2007 Futrell-Camacho

Two judges score Camacho the winner, Ross scores the fight in favour of Futrell

June 10 2005 Prieto-Home

Two judges score the fight for Prieto, Ross gives Home the decision

July 13 2002 Kelley-Soto

Two judges give Kelley the decision, Ross calls it a draw

As for Hatton there's a slight difference here.....

Most feel Hatton won a close decision vs Collazo based on the early knockdown it's not considered a robbery.

Hatton beat Magee clearly 8-4 after a rocky first 3 rounds he didn't "barely" edge Magee that's not true.

That's totally different to a knockdown clearly being missed vs Provodnikov that would've made the fight a draw, almost being knocked out by Vargas being saved by the referee who wrongly heard the bell ring early, and getting what 95 percent of fans consider to be a robbery vs Pacquiao.

 

Maybe it's a losing battle, but I'm on the right side! )

Here are some Jerry Roth scorecards for You - that's the guy who scored it for Pacquiao:
(2001-08-04 Paulie Ayala – Clarence Adams I 115:112 Ayala)
(2010-01-29 Gabrel Campillo – Beibut Shumenov II 115:113 Shumenov)
(2010-08-07 Devon Alexander – Andriy Kotelnik 116:112 Alexander)
(2012-04-14 Brandon Rios – Richard Abril 116:112 Rios)
(2013-09-12 Badou Jack – Marco Antonio Periban 96:94 Periban)

That's the authority on the other hand?
I'm not saying CJ did not have some iffy scorecards, but it's a fallacy to use it as an argument that every decision with her involvement is now a "robbery".

"Most feel Hatton won a close decision vs Collazo based on the early knockdown it's not considered a robbery."
Is that so? I never tested or questioned large enough pool of people, but I know that many people saw it as a robbery. I might search through the forum here later on, see what's the general consensus.

 

Hatton vs Collazo is not classed as a robbery by any stretch of the imagination its considered a very close fight that the vast majority felt Hatton edged based on the knockdown.

Pacquiao vs Bradley is widely considered a robbery that virtually no one has Bradley winning.

There's a big difference between the perception of those two fights and you know it.

 

If I know what You want me to know, then what am I talking about? My belief is that anyone who feels that Pacquiao was robbed against Bradley - should watch the fight again, preferably with commentary off.

As for Collazo vs Hatton, I understand that opinions differ, but certainly many people see it the same way I do. Just from the quick search on this forum:

 

"many" people you quoted a few members on the boxing forum you want me to do the same ?

I had a look at the scores in the RBR thread there was a small minority had it a draw i didn't see a single 115-113 scorecard for Bradley.

Here's a RBR scorecard for Hatton/Collazo from a respected member who scores 1000s of fights @scartissue

Ricky Hatton v Luis Collazo

Watched Luis Collazo fighting last night and heard the announcers talk about the controversial decision with Ricky Hatton and thought I would have a look as I did not see it first time around for whatever reason.

Round 1: 10-8 Hatton (scores a knockdown)
Round 2: 10-10 Even
Round 3: 10-9 Hatton
Round 4: 10-9 Hatton
Round 5: 10-9 Collazo
Round 6: 10-9 Collazo
Round 7: 10-9 Hatton
Round 8: 10-9 Hatton
Round 9: 10-9 Collazo
Round 10: 10-9 Collazo
Round 11: 10-9 Hatton
Round 12: 10-9 Collazo

Total: 115-113 Hatton (actual scores: 115-112, 115-112 and 114-113 all for Hatton)

No bad scores here, just a good close fight. Hatton's aggression against Collazo's counter-punching made it a tight encounter. And any tight encounter is going to cause the opposing corner and the audience some grief. But Hatton ground out the win, despite some dodgy moments in the 12th.

Here's another scorecard for Hatton from another old school respected member @sweet_scientist

Ricky Hatton vs. Luis Collazo: 115-113 Hatton
Callazo: 5,6,9,10 and 12.
Hatton: 1 ( 10-8 ), 3,4,7,8 and 11.
Round 2 even.

Your opinion that Bradley vs Pacquiao 1 was a legitimate win for Bradley is a very small minority compared to media scores and boxing fans aswell as the WBO judges all 5 of them scored it for Pacquiao on rewatch.

No one has Collazo winning widely over Hatton and he had a knockdown scored against him at most if you had Collazo winning it would be by 1 point.

Trying to compare these two fights in terms of controversy is not being honest quite frankly.

 

@Mastrangelo I'm not going to reply to this thread anymore until i rewatch both fights i'm going to rewatch both fights maybe in the next few days and i'll comeback to this thread with my scorecards.