Calzaghe fanboys! Convince me that Joe deserves to be ranked higher than RJJ or BHop!

rjj higher than jc bhop beneath bhop,

 

Joe is easily the greatest 168 pounder all time. I think it is hard to dispute that. However all time p4p I would not think so. Roy and Nard done way more

 

Calzaghe aint done enough to be near BHop and RJJ

 

in terms of who has the better resume calzaghe is nowhere near hopkins. RJJ's resume slightly better than calzaghe's but in terms of skill I put calzaghe just barely ahead of both of them.

hopkins has fought the same way at the same pace for over ten years now so you can't say a prime hopkins would beat him.

if joe fought roy in his prime I think the fight is a toss up. Jones' hands would be slightly faster and he wouldv'e thrown 15 to 20 more punches a round. However jones was all about timing his opponents and calzaghe is nearly impossible to time. but with jones' ridiculous handspeed calzaghe wouldn't have been able to slip so many punches. if joe didn't have such a good chin I'd say roy wins but I say prime calzaghe beats prime RJJ by two or three rounds.

 

RJJ - no.
Hopkins? About level.

 

He made a career out of chasing unifications with Ottke and Beyer. He once offered to take a fight with Ottke for 1 euro plus travel expenses, anywhere Ottke liked. No love. He took to beating opponents of Ottke and Beyer right after they fought them. Never got to unify until 2006 against Lacy.

Calzaghe wanted Hopkins in 2002 when Hopkins was a middleweight, but Hopkins intentionally nixed the deal by demanding more money at the last minute. It's interesting that Hopkins moved straight to light-heavyweight from middleweight and never bothered to stop by 168 for a fight with Joe. It's even arguable that Hopkins was still at or near his prime when he fought Joe--the man seems to have gotten better with age.

Roy Jones never had an interest in fighting Calzaghe...he was the big star, making tons of cash by beating up nobodies in America. By the time Calzaghe got his title in 1997, Jones had already been at light heavyweight for a year. Jones fought Hopkins for a title the YEAR CALZAGHE TURNED PRO. The Toney fight occurred one year later. All the talk of prime Calzaghe vs prime Jones is interesting, but in reality could never have happened. Calzaghe was a huge risk for Jones and the reward would have been minimal (think Calzaghe vs. Dawson).

The talk of Calzaghe hiding in the UK to avoid America is unjustified. He never got a hometown decision, or needed one. He could sell out a 50,000 seat arena and still appear on American PPV. Crowd noise is sometimes said to be beneficial to a fighter, but I'm going to go ahead and assume that it doesn't mean that much to an international-level professional athlete. High-school, sure, college, maybe, but we're talking about professional fighters here. I think that if the money was right, there's no reason a good fighter wouldn't want to go take on Calzaghe, regardless of the location. It just so happens that there wasn't a whole lot available to Calzaghe in America until he hit the big-time by taking down Lacy on Showtime. If there were any great American supermiddleweights around during Calzaghe's time, I'm fairly certain they would have met with him. The fact is that guys like Jermain Taylor, Bernard Hopkins, and Roy Jones were doing just fine hanging out at 160 and 175, and they didn't want or need to fight Calzaghe.

Calzaghe might not have the big names on his resume, but I don't hear many people saying that he would lose if he did. Most guys who are considered legends have losses to people they should have beaten. Calzaghe is 46-0. Most fighters will lose before they amass that kind of record, regardless of who they fight.

 

Legacy of Bernard Hopkins:

Dealt Glen Johson his 1st loss
Gave Felix Trinidad (a blown-up welterweight) his 1st loss
Beat De la Hoya (a blown-up, past his prime lightweight)
Beat Antonio Tarver, who was aged
Beat Winky Wright (a blown up, past his prime jr. middleweight)
Beat Kelly Pavlik, who came up 10 pounds

Lost pro debut-Clinton Mitchell
Lost 1st title shot-Roy Jones
Lost to Jermain Taylor
Lost rematch with Jermain Taylor
Lost to Joe Calzaghe

Legacy of Roy Jones:
Beat Bernard Hopkins
Gave James Toney his 1st loss
Beat Clinton Woods
Beat John Ruiz for a heavyweight title
Beat Antonio Tarver
Beat Felix Trinidad (a blown-up, past his prime welterweight)

Lost to Antonio Tarver in a rematch
Lost to Glen Johnson
Lost to Antonio Tarver in another rematch
Lost to Joe Calzaghe (but past his prime)
Lost to Danny Green (but past his prime by far)

Legacy of Joe Calzaghe
Beat Chris Eubank (past his prime)
Beat Jeff Lacy (who was either overrated or completely ruined)
Gave Mikkel Kessler his 1st loss
Beat Bernard Hopkins (possibly past his prime)
Beat Roy Jones (past his prime)

No losses.

They have 6 good wins, Calzaghe has 5. They have 5 losses, Calzaghe has none. Common themes are that they all seemed to prey upon older or smaller opponents. Hopkins particularly went after little guys, but he's about to make up for it by moving up to heavyweight. I personally think it's unfair to talk of Hopkins and Jones as all time greats while saying Calzaghe is below their level because of the opponents on his resume. Every great fighter fights 80-90% of his fights against nobodies. The good names on his resume are typically few and they almost always have some sort of asterisk due to moving up in weight or being past their prime. The days where you could have Muhammed Ali against Frazier, Foremn, Shavers, and Norton are gone. Great fighters are hard to come by, so we have to judge greatness not only by records but also by skills. And Calzaghe was p4p one of the best, in my opinion.