Calzaghe Fans: "Joe was better than Hagler"

Calzaghe is no ATG and never will be.

Beating Kessler doesn't insure any fighter greatness. Ward had no trouble with Kessler and stopped him whereas Joe lost rounds to him.
Nobody but Joe fanyboys subscribe to the belief Kessler was sick and all that ****.
It was a tko win for Ward. End of story.
He held the smw belts for a day before moving up so he didn't even make any defences as unifed champ.

When he got to LH he beat two faded old timers for a paper belt and avoided the real title holders like IBF champ Dawson.

Who was Hopkins beating at the time that was any good. His most notable win is over Pavlik who was a division bellow him.
Well, Martinez was a division lower than Pavlik and beat him. He deserves far more credit than Hopkins for that win.

At the end of the day Joe done nothing truly great. Undefeated? Ottke went undefeated.

 

This Jon Saxon guy got nothing. All hot air. False promises to school Loudon and in the end he came back with **** all.

 

Being undefeated means jack **** when your fighting b or c level fighters.
I scored Hopkins Calzaghe fight a draw.
The fight with Roy was a travesty.
Hagler,Frazier,Hearns,Duran and then putting calzaghe in?I dont think so.
Calzaghe was a good fighter but we will never now what he could have accomplished.Too bad he never went for big fights.

 

is that the factual amount that Hopkins got paid, or is this just the wronged person in question exaggerating? these are just court papers, not solid and factual. i've seen lots of court papers that have aspects that are way off base. i'm not saying this is the case here, but i wouldn't trust that to be an accurate reading of his payments for the fight.

do you have anything else? i'll have a look myself on Google tomorrow when i have the time.
my amount wasn't verified either, it's just that i'm sure the media over here reported this amount as well as insiders at the time.

there were only 3 fighters that were a problem for Joe back then in terms of fights not happening... Ottke, Jones and Hopkins.
Ottke and his team though did make public that they weren't interested in fighting Joe. not even in Germany. Joe said he was happy to go over, but it was pretty dead in the water if i'm honest from the get go. there were no serious talks or anything.
it didn't really bother me though because i didn't see much prestige in a win.
Jones and Hopkins however brought big rewards in terms of legacy. that bothered me.

true, the Super Middle division isn't looked upon in the way the other divisions are, but my point was that if the fights are there, then they're there. what the fighters weigh shouldn't even come into it. the Super Middle division has had the better and more meaningful fights for years now over the Middle division. IMO. apart from a handful of fights, it's been pretty bleak. it is starting to heat up a bit now though.

there were no guarantees for Joe fighting in America. why have a couple of fights for smaller money to try and drum up interest if Jones and Hopkins turn around and still refuse the fight? if they had something solid for him to work for, then i'm sure he would have went for it. but there wasn't.

look what it did for Khan when he wanted Bradley? it made no difference.

look what it did for Abraham when he took the Miranda rematch to try and get Pavlik? it made no difference. Abraham then moved up and joined the super six.

look what it did for Lennox when it came to Tyson and Bowe? it meant diddly squat.

look how long it took Rigo to get the fight he wanted.

Quillin won't fight GGG, and he's fought in America a few times. listening to Quillin talk about GGG needing to do more to get a fight with him is insulting.

you can't just drop everything on nothing more than hope. it doesn't work like that.

Calzaghe proved himself THE champ when he beat Eubank and Reid, IMO. but if you want to think of him as just the number 1 guy, then there's no problem.

yeah, that fight would be the hottest ticket in town. i just hope they can make it happen. boxing needs for Garcia/Matthysse to happen.

don't be silly. i know it may look at times that a have a problem with Americans, but it's just me firing back for all the Brittard jibes. as well as saying that the American fighter would destroy the British fighter with ease. i mean, can you see Ward knocking Calzaghe out? exactly!

but now i know you're a Yank, i'll try and contain myself out of respect for you. i'll try and post in a more adult manner and not rise to it. but you know what it can be like on here.

some on here claim the American fighter will always win in past match-ups through sheer ignorance and arrogance. i don't put you in that bracket though. you always come across as fair and honest in your opinions. :good

 

like he murdered a former Lightweight who was way past prime? or a former Welter that had been out for years?

he's not knocking out a prime fighter who's bigger than him when that man would be Joe Calzaghe. it isn't happening.

 

nothing in this post has any merit. :good

 

there wasn't any talk of Joe and DM getting it on. which was quite surprising.

you're looking at the Calzaghe situation regarding the injury before the Lacy fight in that way just so you can insult him. it didn't go down like that at all. but continue to think like that if it makes you feel better.

 

so losing rounds to Kessler proved that Joe was a bad fighter or something?

how can Ward of stopped Kessler when it went to the cards? atsch

the lineal championship isn't a paper belt. atsch

 

he's got a lot over a poster like you any day of the week. you're just ESB's whipping boy. :yep

 

Why would they have been any talk?

They fought in different weight classes.

 

Don't know if you were able to view the court documents due to the link issues round here lately, but it was an order by the court and a judgment in favor of Hopkins.


It also states .....(Williams is the plaintiff)........

Williams claims that he received $10,000 (0.888%) of Hopkins’ $1,125,750 purse in
connection with the March 29, 2003 Morrade Hakkar fight; $7,000 (2.15%) of a $325,000 purse in
connection with the December 13, 2003 William Joppy fight; and $15,000 (1.2%) of a $1,250,000 purse in connection with the June 5, 2004 Robert Allen fight. Def. Exh. E at ¶ 21.



Only 325k for fighting Joppy? That's it?



I'm not saying Calzaghe HAD to go to the US at all costs, but if he wanted those fights, that's what he needed to do. I'm not saying by not doing it he was scared or what not, but by not doing it he gave himself virtually no chance of landing those fights. He ended up having a fine career despite not doing it. But these questions are the trade off.

Those other figthers are some fine examples, but it's not an exact science. That's the nature of sports. All you can do is put yourself in the best position overall, it doens't always mean you're chasing a particular fight exclusively. Khan got other big fights, and unfortunately got derailed before he could get the biggest(Mayweather).

I don't think the ultimate goal is Quillin for Golvkin. He may get a bigger or better fight than Quillin whether Quillin fights him or not.
(I think he waxes Quillin btw.) They're certainly grooming him for such.

As for the extracurriculars.... don't change anything on my behalf. Give em hell if they deserve it. It's all in good fun.

 

I notice how you have made a satement and backed it up with...Notthing. No names etc.
Who were these great established MWs that were better than Eubank at SMW?
Hagler was pushed by LW Duran. thats right a LW.

The whole world wanted to see :huh. think you are thinking of why didnt Jones fight DM, now that was a fight many wanted to see

 

bailey,

He's said many times that he was peak then, and I, aswell as many of his fans also agree. He was definitely fortunate against Oscar. But so what? Oscar was a world class fighter. All things considered, it was a very good win for Hopkins.

They were good fighters. But they weren't great and neither is Kessler.

What's the point? Eubank was training to hit 175, and then 11 days out he's told he's fighting a southpaw at 168.

Were the circumstances the same?

Spinks had been payed Millions of dollars and there was nothing left for him to achieve. He was capable of fighting on, but he didn't want to. Eubank retired after the Thompson fights, because he was at the end if the road. He'd got too many miles on the clock.

Again, different circumstances. Ray hadn't fought for 4 years, he'd had no tune up, and nobody gave him a chance. Also, he didn't officially retire until 10 years later.

You can't use his overall history and stats to big up Joe's win. Eubank was an outstanding SMW, but that wasn't the VERSION who Joe fought.

It was ok when he was asking if Roy had got any excuses when they fought.

He was happy to play a part in Rocky, and he was also happy to sign for the fight. He also said he felt great, and that camp had also gone great.

Then afterwards, it was the weight, and he'd been poisoned

I love your stats, they make me laugh. Because just like you, they don't ever allow for circumstances.

Ha!

It wasn't anything to do with a hand injury.

It was a psychological problem.

:good

 

yeah, i was able to view it. don't know how accurate those numbers are though. maybe the $1.5 was what he got as a guarantee, and the rest was from a cut from the PPV?

i've had a look on Google and most articles seem to be saying between $10- $15 million. there isn't anything concrete though. but i will accept that it was more than the $1.5 that i said. :good they all claim that was his biggest fight purse to date.

that's the kind of price that was reported in the UK for the Joppy fight. insiders couldn't believe that the Middleweight champ was getting so little.

i guess we have a different way of viewing things. which is cool.

it wasn't that it was the ultimate goal for GGG, just that it made perfect sense to unify to see which one climbs up the ladder and which one drops a few places. they were both pretty much at the same level as each other. although GGG was the one being talked about most.

i'm still going to give it to them. i'll just be more direct to the poster other than saying things like "all Americans are stupid and such and such..." sometimes it looks like i'm generalizing. but i like you so, i'll be less with the "Americans are idiots" and just call the poster an idiot. :good