Calzaghe already is an all-time great. He beat Eubank and then won for nearly 10 years uninterrupted -- against many subpar opponents but also some quality guys -- and then, as an underdog, dismantled Jeff Lacy. He then beats a young, A-class fighter by clear decision in his mid-30s. He's the most accomplished SMW in that division's history. However, there's no way his abilities compare to those of Jones. The only reason he's the No. 1 all-time at 168 is because Roy didn't stay in that division. If you consider Calzaghe's generation to be the 00s, then you're basically deciding between Joe and Mayweather. At this point I'd take Floyd, for his work at the lighter weights. Beating Castillo twice and Corrales -- when Mayweather was the underdog -- equal wins over Lacy and Kessler, in my opinion, or merit if not historical significance. So, beyond that you have depth, which also clearly favors Mayweather. Hernandez, Chavez, Judah, De La Hoya, Hatton. There may not be an ATG on that list, but today's Hopkins and Woods are no better than that group. I'm a huge Dawson fan, but he alone wouldn't make up for the difference. Hopefully, Floyd will fight Cotto and win, which will render this argument obsolete.
like lacy was favourite against calzaghe. most people have erased it from their memory and which round they had lacy taking calzaghe out in. indeed congrats. notice the division he jumped.........? who do you expect to win? joe is craftier now than he was say 5/6 years ago but not at his physical peak. hops had what, 7-8 years between felix and RJJ? did he beat an ATG (this has to be relevant to the weight classes as well, tito and DLH are not ATG's at 160 and neither is winky at 170)? is he himself an ATG? so say he did beat the guys mentioned in the OP. beating eubank, reid, mitchell, brewer, woodhall, lacy, kessler, hopkins, woods and dawson and retiring a 47-0 two weight division champ wouldn't be worthy of ATG status? hypothetical obviously but still.
No. Still not there with Mayweather, even if Mayweather retired today (which he won't). Definately not there with RJJ, if you consider that to be the same generation. Probably still worse than Hopkins, if you consider that the same generation. The boat has probably sailed on his being the best of his generation, unless he either continues for longer than I think he will, or he does something unexpected like jump up to Cruiser and beat the best there as well. The only way to jump to #1 would be to beat Hopkins, then Dawson, then Haye, then Wlad. Really doubt that's going to happen. Just too weak of a resume in his mid career to legitimately overcome. Best reasonable way to enhance his legacy in 5 fights or less: 1) Hopkins 2) Pavlik (back down at 168 or 170) 3) Dawson (once he's beaten a couple of other top LHWs) 4) One of the lighter CW champs (if Cunningham is still around, he might be appropriate) That would put him in the top 3 or 4 for his generation. Better late than never, and still well above where he'd be if he just retired after Hopkins (in which case you could make a pretty good argument that he should still be behind guys like Morales, Barerra, Pac, Toney, Mosley, DLH, etc.)
Because the money is not relevant to a discussion on legacy You havn't exactly done yourself any favours by bringing up Hopkins, considering this fight should have been made when he wouldn't have had age as an excuse. You can't force people to fight. Besides, he's still in good form, and depending on how competetive the fight is we can make a realistic judgement on how this fight would have turned out It could be Dawson, it could (and more likely from what I've heard) be Pavlik. They are the best guys in and around Joe's weight, so the excuses for them don't really cut it any more than me saying Hopkins big wins were against welterweights. They are all lame excuses If Joe retires undefeated with wins over Eubank, Lacy, Kessler, Hopkins, Pavlik then possibly Dawson/Woods as well as some other solid wins he will undisputably be an ATG, a HOF fighter, or however else you want to put it
No mater what Calzaghe does - RJJ will still be bigger - but then again - nothing wrong being second to a prime RJJ...
Yeah but try telling that to the fanboy brigade. I have my own opinion regarding this, but whatever my feelings are regarding this there is no way in hell that Calzaghe is as bad as a lot of ghetto warriors on here say he is.
I would have Joe at two or three. Depending on the mannor of the wins. He would most probably by two especially if he was to blow out Dawson and Hopkins.
I see Calzaghe beating all of those three. Talking abou tht ebest of his generation is a bit subjective, his been around for years what is excactly the Joe Calzaghe generation - Where does it start from... Joe has a few oponent that would be a great way to end a career, I dont think a win over Hopkins is enough to retire on yet, there are still winnable fights out there. I think Woods will be his final fight and would have retired before the mainstream get too interested in Chad Dawson. Though Erdei-Green is a good unification, that could be a more worth while match than Woods. If Jo ehas it in him, I think he should beat Hop then go onto unify the belts, he is more than capable. He has said he will fight two more times, Hopkins and then if he cant get the Taylor-Pavlik winner, it will be a 175 title holder, probably Woods if he passes Tarver.
If Calzaghe beats Hopkins he is already an all time great, and any more would just back his credibility up. He is one of the most skilled fighters ever, and in the top 3 p4p today. An absolute legend.
Calzaghe better than Mayweather? Assuming he wins those fights he'd be a two weight champ - Mayweather is already a 5 weight champ
Hagler is only a 1 weight champ does that mean that Shane Mosley is a better fighter because he is a 3 divison champ?