Calzaghe or Hamed - who has the better legacy?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by El Cepillo, Dec 26, 2008.


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  1. El Cepillo

    El Cepillo Baddest Man on the Planet Full Member

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    Well, a world title is many things....including a negotiating tool.
     
    El Cepillo, Feb 22, 2009
    El Cepillo, Feb 22, 2009
    #241
  2. BADINTENTIONS2

    BADINTENTIONS2 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    a world title is cheap in boxing on its own. you need some sugar as well and some solid rep.
     
    BADINTENTIONS2, Feb 22, 2009
    BADINTENTIONS2, Feb 22, 2009
    #242
  3. kalunya5964

    kalunya5964 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    It's Calzaghe by a mile! JC retired undefeated was champion for more than a decade with 20 plus successful title defenses.
     
    kalunya5964, Feb 23, 2009
    kalunya5964, Feb 23, 2009
    #243
  4. MAG1965

    MAG1965 Loyal Member banned

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    Hamed is a little like Floyd Mayweather now. If Floyd retires now he sort of leaves his legacy with questions. Hamed was good but retired far too soon.
     
    MAG1965, Feb 24, 2009
    MAG1965, Feb 24, 2009
    #244
  5. El Cepillo

    El Cepillo Baddest Man on the Planet Full Member

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    Calzaghe was a WBO title holder for a decade, the quality of the opposition which he defended that title against was often a bad joke. He was the recognized Champion only after beating Kessler. If Hamed had stayed in his home town, defending his one lesser world title, against mostly bums and nobodies, I'm sure Hamed couyld have been "an undefeated world champion for more than a decade", Hamed didn't though, he had balls, he fought better opposition sooner, he unified his division in less than half the time it took Calzaghe to unify his, and he went to America at a much earlier stage in his career.
     
    El Cepillo, Feb 24, 2009
    El Cepillo, Feb 24, 2009
    #245
  6. Rico Spadafora

    Rico Spadafora Master of Chins Full Member

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    Hamed had nothing but trinket belts he got from beating mediocre to average opposition. The whole world saw what happened when that Glass Jawed fraud stepped up and fought a real fighter. He got his ass handed to him. He then fought another bum and quit the sport in disgrace.
     
    Rico Spadafora, Feb 24, 2009
    Rico Spadafora, Feb 24, 2009
    #246
  7. wvucheerjr

    wvucheerjr Active Member Full Member

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    This could go either way depending on how its worded, "legacy" wise Joe never lost and people will look at that as well as Hamed retiring early. However Joe has too much of a stigma surrounding him over only leaving Wales when the legends were 40+ to have a great legacy himself.
     
    wvucheerjr, Feb 24, 2009
    wvucheerjr, Feb 24, 2009
    #247
  8. El Cepillo

    El Cepillo Baddest Man on the Planet Full Member

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    He lost one fight. On points. If Hamed was "glassed jawed", then I'm the mother****ing Pope. And another thing, if we are taking about resumes, Hamed's absolutely shits all over Vitali Klitschko's. :yep
     
    El Cepillo, Feb 24, 2009
    El Cepillo, Feb 24, 2009
    #248
  9. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    Joe Calzaghe and it isn't even remotely close. Hamed took his first loss, and retired. Calzaghe..just didn't lose.
     
    Addie, Feb 24, 2009
    Addie, Feb 24, 2009
    #249
  10. El Cepillo

    El Cepillo Baddest Man on the Planet Full Member

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    Yes, but why didn't Calzaghe lose? Because he spent most of his career fighting a few good, but aged, fighters, a lot of bums and even more nobodies - in his home town. His entire career was built around protecting that '0', Hamed had a different approach, he fought better opposition sooner in his career, he essentially unified the division a lot quicker, and he fought in America at a much earlier stage. AND....does "legacy" really just mean "achivement & resume", I think we have established there are other criteria, which make this a much closer contest than some people would have you believe.
     
    El Cepillo, Feb 24, 2009
    El Cepillo, Feb 24, 2009
    #250
  11. Bad_Intentions

    Bad_Intentions Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Calslappy does.
     
    Bad_Intentions, Feb 24, 2009
    Bad_Intentions, Feb 24, 2009
    #251
  12. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    You're acting like a nut hugger, Hoya-UK. Stop.

    You know as well as we do that Calzaghe has the greatest legacy, but you're bringing up as many obstacles as you can too avoid admitting it.

    I thoroughly enjoyed Hamed, he was really entertaining, but Joe is the greater fighter.
     
    Addie, Feb 24, 2009
    Addie, Feb 24, 2009
    #252
  13. El Cepillo

    El Cepillo Baddest Man on the Planet Full Member

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    Nope. You need to tell me what you think a legacy is?

    In the 'Who has the better legacy: Tyson or Lewis?', most people went for Tyson, despite Lennox have the better resume and achivements, the logic is that "legacy" doesn't just include resume and achivements, it includes influence, impact, longevity and fame.

    When you look at Calzaghe and Hamed's achivements and resume - Calzaghe clearly has the edge, but that only happened in recent times, and the gap is not as wide as you seem to think.

    Then, moving on to influence and impact on the sport...well the obvious and only choice is Hamed, he had more mainstream appeal, more media coverage, more impact in bringing new fans into the sport and maintaining interest when interest in boxing was declining rapidly in Britain. He was one of the most famous sportsmen on the planet.

    All these factors make up legacy, and they deserve careful consideration, anyone who says "this isn't close" or "Calzaghe by a mile", hasn't thought it through and perhaps needs to actually read the article on the first page on which this topic is based.
     
    El Cepillo, Feb 24, 2009
    El Cepillo, Feb 24, 2009
    #253
  14. "TKO"

    "TKO" Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I agree with some of what you are saying, though I think it is a bit harsh on Calzaghe. Had he retired at the time of the Lacy fight, I would have voted Hamed. It is those two fine late-career wins over Kessler and Hopkins which swing it Calzaghe's way for me. However, look at the world champs or top contenders Hamed beat over six years as a champ:

    Robinson (WBO champ, 8 defences)
    Medina(5 time world champ)
    Johnson (reigning IBF, 8 defences)
    Kelley (former WBC, world #3, one loss in 50)
    Vazquez (reigning WBA, three weight champ)
    McCullough (former bantam champ, two time featherweight challenger)
    Soto (WBC champ, reigning)
    Ingle (future IBF champ)
    Bungu (former long-reigning super bantam champ, hadn't lost in years)

    That, to me, is a better list than the following:

    Eubank
    Reid
    Sheika
    Starie
    Woodhall
    Brewer
    Mitchell

    Plus, Hamed fought all four reigning champions (so what if politics meant they all stripped him) and fought a number of times away from home earlier in his career. There is a lot to be said for him here.

    However, for me, those late wins over two prime, fearsome, undefeated champs in Lacy and Kessler and a top five pound for pounder in Hopkins swing it Calzaghe's way. Just. Hamed's loss to Barrera and the fact that he never attempted to come back is disappointing, but I don't think it can be held against him in this particular comparison. Calzaghe never lost, but then again did he ever face a fighter of the quality of a prime Barrera either? The jury is out.
     
    "TKO", Feb 24, 2009
    "TKO", Feb 24, 2009
    #254
  15. WiDDoW_MaKeR

    WiDDoW_MaKeR ESB Hall of Fame Member Full Member

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    RJJ or Eric Crumble... who has the better legacy?
     
    WiDDoW_MaKeR, Feb 24, 2009
    WiDDoW_MaKeR, Feb 24, 2009
    #255
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