Calzaghe vs Jones Jr, Resumes

atschatsch

 

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A well past prime Sugar Joe was just to much for the steroid cheat.

 

Truth be told James Toney and Virgill Hill trump everyone on Calzaghes resume.

 

RJJ is a drugs cheat, so whatever he achieved is tainted.....

 

toney is very over rated.

 

Charles Brewer > Merqui Sosa
Mikkel Kessler > Reggie Johnson
and Bika - Hill are close at the time they fought their opponents but Roy beat his more convincingly. Roy is a great who has a great resume though, it's a myth that he cherry picked. His resume is better than Calzaghe's, Hopkins' and Toney's overall imo and he was the best fighter out of this lot imo. He get's under rated a lot these days by 'experts' on here. People putting question marks next to Veit and Woodhall are just ignorant though considering that Woodhall is a former WBC champ and Veit has beaten the current WBO LHW champion.

 

Cute, he's quoting fake sport cliche at me.

Here is what you need to realise. Jones Jr fought fighters with an overall lower win/loss percentage than Joe Calzaghe and has an overall lesser win/loss percentage than Joe Calzaghe himself. Jones Jr fought a host of American fighters because he would never leave the country and take on the European fighters. It's no surprise to me that due to fighters like Calzaghe himself, the Klitschko brothers, Adamek and the various number of guys coming out of Europe in the divisions 154 and above, Europe is starting to gain traction as a better fighting region than America currently is.

Now, taking that into account, taking the inflated, bloated, bull**** names like Virgill Hill (who did he actually ever beat?) and James Toney (was great at 160 - then got fat, then got old and fat) for what they were, Americans who had better notability than the guys Calzaghe fought, and the fact that Roy Jones Jr never entered a fight as an underdog in his entire career until the end of his career ( Calzaghe was the first fight he was an under dog in, coincedentally ) - you can't say he has the better resume.

You can say he has the better wins, but you can't refute he also has the losses. Anyone stating Hopkins beat Calzaghe, go learn how to score a fight - 5 clean landed punches per round do not trump 15 ugly landed punches - I'm sorry, they just don't - they never will.

Now, if you really want to argue this, feel free - but ultimately, do you judge a CEO on the profits of one company when he has a number of company collapses after it? I don't, and I'm in the business of judging CEOS.

I also like to judge my fighters on their overall achievement, rather than one victory.

 

Eubank, prime Hopkins and Kessler and yes Hopkins was in his prime against Calzaghe. Certainly his physical peak if not his overall p4p peak. He would not have beaten Pavlik or Tarver like that while he was at middle weight and three years on he's still rated as a top 10 p4p fighter.

 

Good way of putting that mate and it has made me think about it all a little differently afterwards. I do agree that Super Middle has been an under rated division for years and now a tournament like S6 has been introduced people are saying it's loaded with talent just because there are names people recignize now. I certainly think guys like Mitchell, Bika, Woodhall, Brewer, Veit etc would win some fights in the S6.

 

Hopkins wasn't in his physical prime, no one can say that he was. But Hopkins was a late starter in the professional ranks and got better as the years went on, arguably you'd say he was at his best in the days of the fights with Trinidad, Joppy and co but he was at his highest ratings at the Calzaghe fight.

He just whipped Tarver across the ring in a fight he was supposed to lose, beat Winky convincingly and should have gone 2-0 against Taylor in my view, He then absolutely dominated Pavlik and is now still good enough to challenge and arguably beat the live wire in LHW in Pascal.

But yes, let's call him old man Hopkins, forgetting the fact that Joe Calzaghe fought his second to last fight against him, was on his way to retirement as early as the second Mario Veit fight due to the crippling hand injuries he had every fight in the 00s and took on his toughest challengers at the end of his career, when he was established as a name brand and could actually represent a higher risk/reward to the guys who were turning him down 5 years ago.

But to be honest, guys like Reid, Woodhall, Sheika (in his youth), Starie, Mkertchian and co would all bang with and beat many of the Americans who enjoy a favorable rating. It's just plain cold hard fact - we, as Americans, are xenophobic towards other nations and do not believe they're as good

Look at the hype any time an American fighter gets anywhere near challenging a Klitschko at HW. We all know no one will beat the Klitschkos unless Wladimir suddenly regresses to the tense, unable to take a punch character he was 6 years ago or Vitali injures himself in the ring again.... but Cris Arreola had a **** tonne of fans, Calvin Brock, Shannon Briggs, etc... now they take a brash British guy who is very reminiscient of an American and hope he can do it. It's laughable.

Calzaghe's resume sucks in most peoples view cause he didn't fight many notable Americans. He tried several times in the late 90s to get Hopkins to move up and face him and even sounded Jones Jr out about fighting him, both said no, because he couldn't bring the money they could beat beating up on shitty American fighters like Reggie Johnson or Antwun Echols.

Lacy was the first American to call out Joe Calzaghe and he got his fight, got absolutely dominated and made Calzaghe a household name - from that point on, Calzaghe fought the biggest threat in his division (Kessler) - the biggest threat in the division above (Hopkins) and the biggest money fight available to him (Jones Jr)

Talk all you want about that ****, but Lacy got destroyed by Calzaghe and was never the same again. Kessler has since completely changed his boxing style due to being comprehensively beaten on the outside by Calzaghe and try as he might, Hopkins couldn't spoil the boxing enough to get a win over Calzaghe.

Fact remains, he's 46-0 with over 20 title defenses, having faced some very credible opposition. No other fighter in his generation except Floyd Mayweather can say that.

 

Ward is already closings Joes **** resume.

 

Why? Because he beat one name Calzaghe beat? Let's see where Ward stacks after 5-10 title defenses. In my view, he loses to the Kessler that fought Calzaghe and Mundine, also in my view, he's going to have huge problems with guys who are just as rough with their head on the inside as he is, like Bika.

Bute? Will dominate this guy.

 

Because after couple more quality wins he has more top names his resume than Joe has.

Its also Funny how you count Calzaghes Wbogus defenses from the 90ths, real legacy exchanging victories but Toney’s victories doesn’t mater after the SMW division.


You sure have double standards

 

Sigh, when you're hit with reasonable facts, you resort to a bunch of bollocks.

The WBO title in SMW was the first title in the division, therefore defining it's legacy. The division has since become one of the hottly contested and most popular divisions, no thanks to Joe Calzaghe. You can talk about the WBO being a bogus title but in todays age? It probably ranks amongst the best titles, Manny Pacquaio happens to be? You got it - WBO titlist. As does Wlad Klitschko, as does a whole host of other top fighters in their division. But lets say WBO is a bogus title, Calzaghe collected all 4 belts, plus the Ring belt in his division and never lost them - something no one has done since the days of split titles.

So, any more illogical irrational **** you want to throw my way? What are you? A ******, flinging poo? That's what your posts seem like.

Funny enough, Ward's notable wins all come at the expense of fighters who were coming off of recent defeats now isn't it. Rather than guys who were on hot streaks before fighting him.

History revisionism - the domain of idiots who don't really follow boxing and use boxrec as their saviour.

 

What a shame other ESB members cannot post well worded facts like this,instead of resulting to cussing and insulting people when they don't agree with there opininon. :good