Calzaghe WBO reign, "a decade of dross"

You can’t blame Frank.

Joe was more than happy to spend all of those years with him.

He was happy to fight everyone of the guys he fought.

His WBO belt was precious to him and the number of defences that he made.

The fact that he needed to fight Peter Manfredo who was a C class reality TV star, in order to gain more U.S. exposure, speaks volumes.

His talent was never in question. But guys like Roy and Bernard weren’t going to travel to Wales and move divisions for a WBO champ who was relatively unknown outside of Europe at the time.

None of those fights were viable.

Joe needed to move up to LHW and fight in the U.S. to get those kinds of fights back in the late 90’s-early 00’s.

He needed to raise his profile to create a public demand for the fights. But he didn’t do that, because he was happy doing what he was doing.

 

How did Roy spend 7 or 8 fighting nobodies and has beens?

 

Complete nonsense which we’ve discussed before.

He didn’t fight nobodies for 7-8 years.

HBO didn’t call him reluctant, they were desperately trying to make fights with Dariusz and Hopkins.

He didn’t avoid Liles or Collins.

Liles blew the fight by going back and asking for more money.

He deserves criticism for Nunn, but he initially dropped the belt to fight James Douglas at HW.

Most people didn’t want to fight Joe, as he was relatively unknown.

 

Brannon was a mandatory and McCallum was a title fight in a new division.

 

Ultimately this is correct. When Lewis and Hamed, and later Hatton realised that the best way to get the biggest fights was to essentially cross the pond to where the biggest fights took place, Joe stayed at home fighting Mkrtchyan and Salem in ice rinks for the WBO title.

The landscape has changed a bit with Joshua, but Joe was always happy to stay at home in the days when you had to really travel for the biggest names.

 

Hey bud - hope all is well.

My take on the WBO at the time is that it was very much a case by case basis thing. Taking the fighters out of the equation, it was the newest and least-respected of all the belts. The Ring were (justifiably) resistant to another unnecessary governing body, even though they were far more eager to adopt the US based IBF a few years earlier.

It really depended though on the division, the fighters and the context though. At heavyweight, the WBO belt had secondary status until after Lewis had retired. Fighters would give up the belt on a whim (eg Bowe), or use it as a stepping stone to a proper belt (eg Akinwande challenging Lewis).

In other divisions it was a different story. The Ring were happy to acknowledge Barrera as the best fighter at super-bantam in the mid 90s, and there was little or no clamour for him to fight Bungu or Cermeno to be a "legitimate" champion. When he later fought Morales first time round, it was recognised as a unification fight in a way that Lewis-Akinwande wasn't.

During Calzaghe's era, super-middle was just about the most eurocentric division in boxing, where most of the key players were based in Europe. The WBO had been adopted by European promoters (and audiences) as a recognised title much earlier.

The earlier posts on the thread suggested that Calzaghe's status at the time was lesser than that of the WBA, WBC and IBF tilists. There's more than enough ammo to fire at Calzaghe without distorting reality and pretending that to the boxing world Bruno Girard and Glenn Catley were perceived as more credible champions than him.

At that point in time, and in that division, the WBO was a recognised belt with broadly the same status as the others. It may not have been true in some other divisions, but that underlines that it really was based on the fighters themselves rather than the organisation.

While the WBO were a bunch of clowns, it's not like the rest were any better. While the WBO were moving dead fighters up the rankings, the IBF had both Fidel Castro Smith and Slugger O'Toole in their IC top 10. I'm not sure what is worse if both scenarios are taken to their conclusion; scheduling a fight where one guy is already dead, or one where the same guy fights himself?

 

Maske had retired before Roy went up to LHW.

Everyone knows about saga with Dariusz.

Roy didn’t want to take 3 belts to Germany and Dariusz wouldn’t fight in the U.S.

He definitely deserves criticism for messing Nunn around, but he did intend to fight James Douglas at HW for huge money at the time.

He didn’t rob Roch of his belt, the WBC did. And yes, that was outrageous.

He wasn’t schooled in the Griffin fight. Get real. Griffin was ready to go, and he was awarded the win on a technicality after being laid out on the canvas. It can’t even be celebrated as a win.

 

Yes he was

 

Let’s not be naive.

Joe didn’t sign a ten year contract with Frank.

He was more than happy to fight every guy he fought.

He’s immensely proud of his number of WBO defences and he’s even bragged about them.

He was content doing what he did, just like Eubank before him.

He never had the confidence to try and push for the Roy fight earlier.

 

He was the overwhelming favourite because despite him being a professional for 13 years at that point, Joe was still relatively unknown outside of Europe.

If the U.S. fans had been familiar with him, the odds for Lacy would never been what they were.

 

You’re talking nonsense.

The fight with Roy was taken over Kelly Pavlik.

The Kelly Pavlik fight was there for him.

Before they split, Frank Warren had already been talking to Gary Shaw.

He told him to leave the fight with Roy alone.

Roy didn’t pick and choose fights.

He just had a few keep busy fights which were approved by HBO to keep him ticking along.

Every fighter does that.

Don’t forget that he had mandatory obligations from three of the main organisations.

Joe was the one who happy fighting low level competition.

His resume is very weak for a man of his talent, especially from Eubank to Lacy, over a 9 year span.

 

Hiya mate, I’m good, thanks.

I’m just living on here at the moment. Ha!

I hope that you’re okay.

I agree 100% with everything you’ve said.

Great post.

Your final paragraph literally made me laugh out loud.

Yes, the other organisations were no better.

Joe was rightfully recognised as the best in his division for the majority of his reign.

His status certainly wasn’t lesser than the champs of the other organisations.

The issue, was that being a WBO champ at SMW, didn’t get him the exposure that he needed in order to try and fight the best guys in the world who were within his reach. But at the end of the day, that’s how he wanted it. So it didn’t really matter. It’s just that I used to get sick of him whining to the media that he wanted Roy and Hopkins, when he’d just fought a guy like Will McIntyre or someone. I was literally sat there watching the TV thinking “Those guys who you’re fighting is the reason why you’re not getting those other fights”

He should have moved up to LHW and fought in the U.S. much earlier than what he did.

 

You know why Calzaghe wasn't rated highly? The Americans are pessimistic and only tend to recognise their own. It's always been very difficult for us Brits to be rated highly at world level in the US and The Ring magazine and ratings system is renown for such bias. Lennox Lewis wasn't rated in the US until the latter stages of his career as was the case with Calzaghe, you have to have consistent dominance over several years before the US acknowledges your presence and rates you. Roy Jones Jnr is actually my favourite fighter so i'm not showing favouritism towards Calzaghe.

 

He wasn’t rated highly because he spent the majority of his career in Britain where he fought mainly B and C class opposition.