Can a case be made for David Haye as and ATG?

Discussion in 'British Boxing Forum' started by catchwtboxing, Apr 11, 2020.

Was David Haye a great fighter?

  1. Yes, he did enough.

    28.6%
  2. No. He just didn't get there.

    71.4%
  1. Jamzy ⭐

    Jamzy ⭐ Active Member Full Member

    1,449
    927
    Sportsbook:
    1,049
    Oct 8, 2018
    No. Top fighter and ATG.
     
  2. DON1

    DON1 ICEMAN Full Member

    4,603
    581
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Apr 6, 2006
    Thats your view. ATG is pushing it.
     
  3. Robney

    Robney ᴻᴼ ᴸᴼᴻᴳᴲᴿ ᴲ۷ᴵᴸ Full Member

    84,443
    16,946
    Sportsbook:
    2,000
    Jan 18, 2010
    Usually when Haye is mentioned for concideration for HOF or ATG, the backers will exaggerate his accomplishments.

    Undisputed Cruiser champion, first since Holyfield.

    No, he wasn't, he was unified (WBA/WBC/WBO, Ring) and the consensus #1 for a brief time, for winning 2 titlefights. He did what Bell had done almost 2 years earlier, who had even more claim at "undisputed", but also not quite with the WBA/WBC/IBF/Ring belts (same as Holy). But the WBO already was a major belt by then.
    Dominated Cruiser.
    Again no. He hardly had any titlefights and moved up to HW pretty quickly. Either you have him going 2-0, 2KO's in titlefights or 2-1, 2KO's if you count the IBO strap. And although he won almost all his bigger fights by TKO, he got buzzed and dropped in quite a few of them, resulting in the whole bogus "copyright claim" takedown of all the videos he looked bad in on youtube. Not much dominating going on there.
    The first to wobble the giant (Valuev) winning the WBA title, and it being the only way to fight him with that size difference.
    Valuev had been wobbled before, and had been beaten before in more eye pleasing manner and in come forward style. That WBA strap that was on the line in the fight was as paper as they come, as Valuev had lost it to Chagaev, but the WBA just handed him another while Chagaev still had and defended his up until a week for the Klitschko fight.

    In his HW run he had 2 good results. Edging out Valuev and stopping Chisora in a war.
    At Cruiserweight he stopped Fragomeni, Mormeck in a war and Enzo Mac...
    That's his legacy, and it's pretty good. But not remotely near consideration for being called great.
     
    PaddyGarcia likes this.
  4. ryanm8655

    ryanm8655 Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,229
    2,126
    Sportsbook:
    1,111
    Oct 23, 2008
    Mostly agree. Good enough to be a British great but not ATG. One of the best cruiserweights of all time but it’s a young division.
     
  5. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Boxing Junkie Full Member

    8,707
    5,166
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jul 4, 2014
    In fairness, Ruiz was probably his best fight at heavy.
     
  6. andrewe

    andrewe Ezekiel 33 banned Full Member

    665
    540
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Mar 13, 2020
    On an heavyweight H2H list, he's top 15 all time.

    In terms of an ATG list, he'd be top 25 probably, maybe lower. He doesn't have an outstanding resume. But he is one helluva fighter!
     
  7. Dangerwood84

    Dangerwood84 Active Member Full Member

    1,367
    1,461
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Sep 21, 2017
    Instant reaction, yes at cruiser, no at heavy.
     
  8. ryanm8655

    ryanm8655 Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,229
    2,126
    Sportsbook:
    1,111
    Oct 23, 2008
    I haven’t done a list but I’d be suprised if I had him that high on either.
     
  9. PaddyGarcia

    PaddyGarcia Fan of Antichrist Marxism Full Member

    15,834
    12,565
    Sportsbook:
    332
    Feb 13, 2014
    I mean, absolutely not.

    Anyway, on topic, no. As a British ATG, I will hear that argument.
     
    Wizbit1013 likes this.
  10. Robney

    Robney ᴻᴼ ᴸᴼᴻᴳᴲᴿ ᴲ۷ᴵᴸ Full Member

    84,443
    16,946
    Sportsbook:
    2,000
    Jan 18, 2010
    Really? That version of Ruiz hadn't really been relevant the last 5 years with only a decent decision win over a completely past it McCline in that period.
    Ruiz was done, and Haye fought on the backfoot for large portions of the fight anyway. Blatantly rabbitpunching him troughout the fight.
    That was not a good showing at all in my book.
     
  11. Devon

    Devon Active Member Full Member

    1,254
    938
    Sportsbook:
    2,511
    Dec 31, 2018
    An ATG Crusierweight because he beat everyone there was to beat, what more do you have to do? An ATG heavyweight? Hell no and it's weird really because most ATG crusierweights become highly successful heavyweight, but Haye didn't do much to be remembered in heavyweight, his heavyweight career seemed to be mainly about making money, his crusierweight career was about creating legacy, you can see why because there is a hell of a lot of money to be made at heavyweight especially when you're an undisputed crusieeweight moving up
     
  12. andrewe

    andrewe Ezekiel 33 banned Full Member

    665
    540
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Mar 13, 2020
    David Haye deserves a high spot on an h2h list. He beats Joe Louis, prime for prime.
     
  13. PaddyGarcia

    PaddyGarcia Fan of Antichrist Marxism Full Member

    15,834
    12,565
    Sportsbook:
    332
    Feb 13, 2014
    No he doesn't
     
    Wizbit1013 and Momus like this.
  14. Heisenberg

    Heisenberg @excelsioroptimum Full Member

    1,907
    2,747
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Apr 30, 2017
    I like Haye but never an ATG. You could argue that he’s not even the best British cruiserweight as his 2-0 world championship record at the weight compares poorly to Johnny Nelson’s 14-1-1. Going by H2H you’d say yes but by resume it’s a no. Also hurts Haye that he never avenged a defeat during his career.
     
  15. FP 2.0

    FP 2.0 Member Full Member

    262
    241
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Aug 12, 2019
    An ATG BRITISH fighter but not an ATG fighter if that makes sense
     
    Wizbit1013 likes this.