Can I see your MW list? Top 10, 15, 20, whatever?

MW is horrific. It is the hardest division to rank by distance IMO. I'm not happy with even the very good lists that I have seen, all seem to be flawed. I want to try and work a list up though. Some of my thinking on some of the problematic champions:

DICK TIGER - Beat many future and former champions, including Terry Downes, Giardello, Fullmer, Benvuneti. Title challengers like Fernandez and Carter, top contenders like Webb and Armstrong. Matched against other great strong men/punchers from the division, he proved himself the better, handling Carter and throwing Fullmer to the deck. Probably the definitive MW strongman. Head to head he's a bit of Foreman - vulnerable against slick boxers, but, in his case, genuinely close to impossible to out-muscle and out-punch. I think he belongs in the 12, though I'll see.

CHARLEY BURLEY - He's not a genine middleweight. He's a big welter and a light-middle. His best weight h2h would be Welter IMO. The nature of his style - he fought big, and with his reach - made him vulnerable to the very best big men that he faced. He's got a great resume at the weight but is to small for the top 5. Closer to 10.

HOLMAN WILLIAMS - A really good list of men beaten at and around the weight. Some of his best wins are with guys who were slightly above the weight when he was below, or when he was slightly above. Anyway, Williams is right on Burley's coat-tails at the weight and has an argument for the top 10.

NP JACK DEMPSEY - Too small. I'm not going to rate him at MW. That's contriversial, but i've decided to leave him out, at least for the moment. The combination of size and no film led me to this decision.

SAM LANGFORD - I'm leaving him out. It's unclear to me what he did at 160.

TIGER FLOWERS - I think he's underated in the thread. The guy has two wins over Greb, he was in a very close one with Mickey Walker, I personally wouldn't have him fare behind the other Tiger, if at all.

BOB FITZSIMMONS - I actually agree with Mendoza that he should be highly regarded at the weight. It's possible he should be made favourite against all but the very very best of them. MW resume is not at all bad. I'm not as worried about his size issue (MW limit was smaller back then) because he beat bigger men at a higher weight - and on film, too!

There's plenty more to discuss, but that's my thinking based upon some of your guys posts and the problems raised in the thread.

 

And yet we all know a first tier great like Monzon is to be above a second tier great like Hopkins. It's hard, but I'm up for one more stab.

 

Well I don't, that's the point of the thread. Trying to get some ideas in order for a list, might have a stab at it tomorrow.

1- Sugar Ray Robinson
2 - Harry Greb
3 - Carlos Monzon
4 - Marvin Hagler

Is all I got right now. In the past, #5 has been Burley, Walker, Ketchel...right now I think it would be Hopkins. I think that would probably be my five.

 

Yup. Me and me only. And bizzarely enough it's the position i'm the happiest and most secure with

Still, I could happily switch him with Greb :roll:

 

I'm happy with Sugar at #1 man. He has the credentials to make that top 4 and no MW ever did it better than he did thenight of the St Valentine's Day Massacre. That's my favourite performance by any fighter, and i'm a Burley fan man! **** Sugar Ray Robinson.

 

Hahahahahahahaha