Can someone explain to me, through his resume, why people call Usyk a top 5 ATG?

Can't say I agree

Chisora took 3 of the first 4 maybe and lost every round there after

He shot his load and had nothing to offer from that point onwards

It was very easy from that point onwards

 

For me, Usyk is an H2H top ten on the 'eye test' but is not a top ten ATG heavyweight because of his repetitious and relatively light resume.

 

How is holding a belt a plus if you defend against journeyman?

Charles Martin held a belt while Povetkin did not. I don't know anyone who rates Martin above Povetkin

 

That's still an 8 4 score card and goes against you saying it was even in the tenth

Del had his moment in the fight and has further lived off of this myth that he run Uysk close

Truth is he did ok initally and Uysk wasn't at his best but still eventually dominated the plodding fool

 

Here's another take tho.. considering that a great deal of the past HWs were under 200 pounds you could actually include his entire resume & then he would break top 10 for me... Fighters like Hunter, Gassiev & Breidis are quality operators.

 

I don't call him top 5.

I call him GOAT.

 

To each his own. Though to expand on my points a bit further:

Iron Mike looked like a killer because his level of competition was quite poor. He couldn't put away guys like Tillis and Mitch Blood Green. So I don't see how you can have that fight anything better than a 50/50. We're talking about a guy in Usyk that has been hit by bigger punchers and never gone down once, while also being far and away the best technician Mike would have ever seen in the ring.

Frazier is just too small and too one-dimensional for Usyk. Comparing him to Briedis doesn't fly with me because their styles are completely different. Briedis had his success against Usyk by counter punching, not by swarming and pressuring Usyk. Plus, the big myth is that that fight was razor close. On the cards? Sure. But Metcalfe has it out for Usyk (same guy who gave Fury the win in his 1st fight with Usyk) and I think the judges were swayed by how exciting the fight was and how raucous Briedis' home crowd was there in Latvia. The stats don't seem to think it was all that close. I've probably watched that fight 10 times and I don't, either. Briedis was retreating so much in the second half of that fight you might as well have stuck one of those forklift beepers on him.

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As far as Wlad goes, no. You can try and talk Wlad up all you want, he was limited. Luckily he never had to fight his brother and he got to coast through the weakest era of heavyweight boxing ever. Like I said, Usyk himself thought he could beat Wlad easily. Hell, there are stories about Wlad's time in camp before the fight with Fury where Usyk was kicking his ass constantly. It got so bad Wlad kicked him out of the camp. Argue that that was old Wlad, sure, but Usyk is a nightmare for him at any time. Constantly turning him, feinting him, and Usyk is phenomenal in the clinch as he showed against Fury. So if Wlad ever managed to snag him, he'd have just been out-maneuvered.

Maybe Holmes would be closer to a 50/50. Still though, just no experience fighting southpaws really. And for as great as Holmes was, his competition level was never spectacular. He'd have been in for it with a guy of Usyk's skill level dropped in against him, IMHO.

 

That's what all the Chisora truthers conveniently leave out. That Usyk hadn't adapted to HW yet and only weighed a hair over 215 pounds on the night. Delboy outweighed him by 40 freaking pounds. If a crazy person is charging you, swanging for the fences, and holding you and hitting then anybody is going to struggle with that. Usyk let it go on for three rounds to wear Derek out and then he beat the living daylights out of him for the other nine rounds.

 

Only thing I'd disagree with is Uysk let it happen
I dont think so, he just wasn't expecting it and after a short time adapted and took over fully

 

John Fury thought Usyk intentionally took the foot off the pedal when he could get Chisora out of there to entice AJ to a fight. I don't know if that has any merit to it, but Usyk did look a bit apprehensive at times.

But on the other hand, Chisora is crazy... Just 6 months later he gave Parker a good scrap.

 

Parker was in a period of transition
Del probably won that first fight tbh

And John Fury is daft
Uysk had the mandatory spot he didn't need to force anything
AJ would never drop a belt to his credit

 

Usyk's beaten:

Fury
Fury
Joshua
Joshua
Briedis
Dubois
Dubois
Chisora
Hunter
Gassiev

He was the underdog twice, the away fighter in the majority of these fights, and the B-side against Fury 1, Joshua 1, Joshua 2 and Chisora. Yet he still went 10-0, and unified all of the belts at cruiserweight and heavyweight. And there are no "gifts" on his record either.

Moreover, Usyk has never been dropped with a headshot so far as anyone can tell in his entire career amateur or pro, and he hasn't officially been dropped to the body as a pro either.

It's an almost uniquely perfect heavyweight career, preceeded by an almost uniquely perfect cruiserweight career, and in much tougher eras than Marciano's HW era or Holyfield's CW era. This is after winning everything as an amateur too.

If you look at the six other HoF/likely HoF heavyweights of the last 25 years they all have 2-5 losses, and three of them have draws. Lewis had 2 losses and a draw, Vitali 2 losses, Wlad 5 losses, Fury 2 losses and a draw, Joshua 4 losses, Wilder 4 losses and a draw. And the latter three fighters aren't done yet, and most if not all of them will likely pick up additional career blemishes.

Usyk has a good case for most perfect boxing career of all time.

 

I just want to point out that it is silly to rate him anything before his career is over. He could lose one, and his stock goes way down. Conversely, Fury and/or Joshua could become a three time champion, and Gassiev could become a pretty good WBA solo champ after he retires, and his stock skyrockets. Let the era play out.

The problem here is the difficulty in comparing eras. Most heavyweight champs have more significant heavyweight wins, but for those who include a head-to-head component, Usyk's opponents have a better size-to-athelticism ratio than most of the champs of the past.

I am comfortable just saying that he is one of the uber-elite of the sport's history. If someone wants to exclude him as a top heavy--whatever. So he's a pound per pound great--which is better than being a one-weight great--who happened to excel at heavyweight.

Sure, say it however you like. You are not going to diminish what he has accomplished.

 

they can't, but it's fashionable to trash boomers

 

Because he obviously beats all the ATG's.
People point out the flaws in the opponents he faced but they ignore the terrible losses of their 'ATG's'.
There's just no way all the fan favs Lewis, Tyson, Evan Fields etc. are going to go 6-0 against Fury/AJ/Dubious.
And the idea Ali/Frazier/Foreman do is just laughable.
Usyk has fought basically all sizes and styles from cruiser to SHW, which encompasses basically everything you'll find in the HW spectrum.