Can Wlad Klitschko beat a lot of old school greats?

Everyone talks about how Wlad's chin would hold up against Dempsey, and rightfully so, but what about the reverse?

Dempsey fought a pathetic set of punchers and Willard barely landed.

 

Well he has probably at least tasted power similar to Wlads and has always taken it.

Wlad has faced power like Dempseys and not taken it.

I think it is Wlads chin that is the greater issue here.

 

I agree. When Dempsey is sized up to any other all time great the only factor that anyone ever mentions is his punching ability and what he;d do to the other guy. The question should also be, " can he take it as well as he can dish it out ".

Wlad does not way 190 Lbs, and nor is he barely 6 feet tall. He is a giant among heavyweight champions. Willard was as well, but he was also 38 years old, off for nearly 3 years, and was never proven nor beat as many ranked fighters as Klitschko. Billy Miske, Brennan, Gunboat Smith, Willie Meenhan, Luis Firpo and a number of other Dempsey opponents don't quite fit the bill either.

 

Who on his record was a similar puncher to Wlad ? Even if we ignore speed, technique and delivery then Willard is probably the only one, but he didn't really land much on Dempsey.
The only guys who staggered or dropped Klit were big hard hitting guys.

Dempsey was staggered by Carpentier (lightheavy), dropped twice by Firpo (might have something resembeling Wlad's power but is lightyears away in delivery, speed, technique, basically knocked Dempsey down every time he landed something decent or better), Brennan staggered him, Sharkey (non-puncher) staggered him, Tunney (even for a lightheavyweight he was a light hitter) knocked him down.

He is dropped in 2 and staggered in 4 of his 8 filmed bouts. Wlad doesn't have the advantage that most people haven't seen half of his fights where those things happen like Dempsey does.

Oh, did i mentioned yet that fireman Flynn KO'd him in a single round? He was also knocked down nine times by a lightheavyweight who would be lucky to be classed as a journeyman.


People often consider Louis' chin to be weak, but fact is that Dempsey got stunned, staggered or dropped more often. Only the fact that Louis had so many fights seems to exaggarate his numbers of time being hurt and the fact that not many have seen Dempsey's films and that he hardly faced punchers.

 

Come one guys, I know we're all excited that the super fights are happening and boxing is back on top, but stop with these stupid ass threads.

Wlad beats Ali? Wlad beats Joe Louis? :rofl

 

You're right, and I knew that years ago. But do you see how I exaggerated what happened? Do you see how I failed to mention Dempsey's obliteration of Carpentier, and how I avoided the near-fact that he was taking it easy on him? In essence, I was approaching the subject from your perspective, just reversed on Dempsey instead of Marciano. Marciano also obliterated Moore (who was infact a lot better than Carpentier, which would make up for any 'Dempsey was taking it easy' argument).

 

Not when one approaches an argument like you do.

 

If by a 7' fighter you mean Ewart Potgeiter, he was never a ranked fighter at all. Valdes might be a reasonable criticism. Potgeiter is pretty weird. He was nothing except big.

As for Marciano fighting the same # of fights as Dempsey, he did fight about the same number of top fighters. Dempsey was simply fighting second raters for years in buzzard stops out in the west. Attacking Marciano does not make Dempsey one smidgeon better.

 

rocky had his own style that he perfected. he didnt need to emulate dempseys style.

 

Read the post i replied to, and discover my guise.

 

Their styles weren't even close.

Charley Goldman helped develop Rocky's style. Maybe he took a pointer or two from Dempsey's style, but no way did he try to emulate or copy Dempsey. They developed a style that maximised Rocky's strenghts, and continued to refine and develop it right until Rocky's last fight.
Basing your style on someone else's is pure madness.

 

Dempsey:
9 times against Sudenberg
1 time by Flynn
2 times by Firpo
1 time by Tunney

That's 13 times.

Louis, off the top of my head:

2 times against Schmeling
1 time against Braddock
1 time against Galento
1 time by Buddy Baer
3 times by Walcott
2 times by Marciano

That's a total of 10 times.

Now consider that Louis fought top10 ranked opponents from the age of 20 to 37. Dempsey only from the age of 23 to 32. Louis fought more than twice as much top opponents yet was down less.
I don't see how one can rate Louis' chin lower than Dempsey's, which was pretty suspect if you ask me.

 

do u realise just how young green Dempsey was vs Sudenberg? Funny people mention the no neutral corner rule in favour of Dempsey but fail to mention that when he was himself floored, he was hit as soon as he got back up. it is nonsense to even count Dempsey's fight with Sudenberg

 

check this out: Dempsey had barely turned twenty by this Sudenberg fight, had a grand total of 13 recorded fights, no amateur background, no proper management, or trainer or management so he obiously was far from his best when he was knocked down by Sudenberg, he was also an underfed light-heeavy at the time. Keep up the amazing work