Can You Imagine The Beating Holyfield, Moving Up Gives Joshua!?

since Holmes was brought up into discussion.

i think 1992 Larry Holmes beats AJ too.

he would be one old man bridge too far for AJ.

 

@Man_Machine My reply your comment i couldn't quote you because apparently it reached the limit.

It is a stretch because Holyfield isn't known for stopping fighters early, when discussing mythical match ups we go with the most realistic scenario, and that isn't very realistic atleast in my view. No disrespect intended as i know your a knowledgeable poster, but the only noteworthy stoppage Holyfield has early was vs a fat unintersted Douglas who didn't even want to be there. If Holyfield is stopping Joshua which i do think could very well happen, it would more than likely be in the 2nd half of the fight.

I agree somewhat but Joshua also has a very good uppercut at close range, which would be a deadly weapon vs Holyfield. My point is you've stated a few times that Joshua isn't in Holyfield's league, but lesser fighters than Joshua gave Holyfield alot of trouble. I mean Stewart as i pointed out already is a pretty slow plodder, and is leagues below Joshua yet he was able to lure Holyfield into a brawl and hurt him. And whilst your correct both men could hit so could Joshua, and i would argue Joshua may hit harder than both men and has better technique and quicker hands.

Oh i agree Joshua certainly has his own flaws, and like i said i favour Holyfield in this match up. My only issue with what you said. Is you suggested this could be a bit of a blowout and early victory Holyfield, i think if Holyfield did brawl with Joshua, and like you pointed out with his warrior mentality it's more than likely he would. He could be hurt/rocked and possibly floored, Holyfield sometimes went to war when it wasn't always in his best interest, but saying that i think Holyfield could overcome that with his better stamina/toughness, and get to Joshua late on after a few rocky moments.

Yes i'm aware of that and i never said Ruiz was in Holyfield's league, but Ruiz is talented and has some of the quickest handspeed in the modern era of Heavyweights. Despite Holyfield being old he knows what he's seeing, and if thinks Ruiz has some of the quickest handspeed he's ever seen in recent memory who am to argue. I'd say Ruiz is definitely one of the fastest and better combination punchers at Heavyweight we have seen in quite sometime.

It's relevant because Holyfield often got himself in wars and got hurt/rocked numerous times, and that could be dangerous against a puncher like Joshua who is bigger and better than the likes of Stewart, Cooper. No doubt the Ruiz loss was a bad loss, but i also don't think Joshua was at his best in that fight. there was talks of him being KO'ed in sparring having a concussion, he also didn't look confident prior to the fight and looked off to me. Whether or not that's just excuses or Joshua didn't recover from the temple shot in the 3rd round who knows, your point is valid though no argument from there. But i also think Ruiz and Holyfield have different type of strengths.

I agree Holyfield going the distance with both isn't necessarily a bad thing, i was just pointing out how it was perceived at the time.

Well Wladimir had recently only just lost his crown after being champion for 12 years, yes he lost an abysmal sparring session to Fury where neither man did much. But i actually think the way Wladimir fought against Joshua, was one of his better performances since Pulev fight. Wladimir looked flat against Fury and Jennings, but had a real go and opened up vs Joshua in a very good fight. And despite Wladimir being near the same age Foreman, Holmes, were. The difference is Wladimir was considered number 1 Heavyweight until he lost to Fury, and kept himself in great shape unlike Foreman/Holmes who were way above there prime fighting weight.. The Wladimir of the Joshua fight for me would of beaten every Heavyweight at that time, minus Joshua of course and Fury.

Finally i think i'm done with this conversation now, i tend to not like long back and forth debates. I know i'm the one who started the conversation, but no offence to you but i just don't feel like i have anything else to say. And i don't want to seem like i'm nit picking and just responding for the sake of it, nice to share some thoughts with you and lets just say, yes we have different opinions on certain things. But when it comes down to it we both think Holyfield wins this mythical match, lastly if you reply to this i'll let you have the last say on the matter good day to you.

 

Holmes fought a defensive tricky fight on the ropes, Holyfield said himself he trouble finding him. And when Holmes held his arms out he nullified Holyfields offence. Holyfield is not some monster KO puncher he has respectable power.

 

None taken.

I think we've both made out points clear, with there being little else either of us could add.

There are no rights or wrongs here - just perspectives.

A good day to you too, sir.

 

I think it'd be a fairly even fight through about 6 or 7 rounds then Holy starts grinding the gassing body builder down and stops him. Amazing isn't it? Not so long ago there were threads that had people saying Joshua could beat Muhammed Ali. Just goes to show that hype like the force can have a strong influence on the weak minded casual fan.

 

Outstanding debate from you and @Dynamicpuncher who continues to be a courteous and knowledgeable gem on this forum.

In fact, I think I have sided with him against you on this, manmachine, old mate which is not a position I am used to being in. But you debated so well, I got past worrying about what you were both saying and just enjoyed it.

Debates with courtesy and mutual respect are so much better than the slanging matches a difference of opinion often descends into around here and a chance for all to learn.

 

I mean, both prime.. Holyfield would KO him. If he uses that footwork, he's unbeatable., untouchable, just

he would KO prime Holmes, Joshua and prime Tyson

 

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and still, that's not the best of Holyfield

look, Holyfield is the greatest heavywieight since/after Ali

 

i would not think so.

 

I agree with much of what you said regarding the guys who beat Bruno beating AJ…except Smith that is.
I think AJ beats Bonecrusher. Bruno himself was jabbing this guy to death for 9.5 rounds with no problems before Frank does what Frank does against a better class of opposition …gasses out, gets caught, gets stopped. I can see AJ KOing Smith before it got to the stage where he gets gassed.

 

Nay.
Usyk os bigger than Holyfield and with a much longer reach, that matters.

 

Yeah, so AJ is in this fight. The issue is how long is he gonna wanna stay in it? Holyfield only loses his head to fight and AJ ain’t into it. Evander doesn’t lose combat composure or get shell shocked, he just gets dirtier and more aggressive, open yeah, but he’s gonna dog Joshua like the clown he is and chase him out of the ring. Evander shows him what heart looks like.